nfoligno

If that is the case, my expectations are pretty low. I mean, all he has done this year is workout. If he isn't strong now, will he ever be?

I think you are missing the original point. When NO drafted Bush, what was the general public opinion? As I recall, most felt NO made a GREAT move, while Houston screwed the pooch passing on him. NO at the time had a very good RB in Deuce McAlister, yet choose to draft Buch regardless. Few thought it was a bad move. Similar, Minny had a RB coming off a very successful season (Chester the molester) and yet drafted AP. Few thought this was a bad move. We had TJ, and drafted Benson. We did it then because we felt Benson was a franchise back, while TJ was not. Argue the scouting, but the point is, even if you have a good player at a position, if you feel you have the potential to draft a franchise player, you do it. Whether Bush is a bust or a boom is not the point in this discussion. The point was more a matter of public opinion. Few argued the pick of Bush, even though NO already had McAlister. For the record, I was among the few.

Just read that St Clair is set to start at LG this week. I have no problem benching Metcalf who has been awful. I mean, he has been worse than a one armed Brown. But is Beekman so bad that we need to start an OT at OG? W/ only two games remaining, it is obviously development and evaluation time, hense why Orton is playing. Either Beekman is so bad that our staff doesn't believe he is worth the development time or they simply have no clue when it comes to developing players in meaningless games.

how can you possibly compare talent/play between tackles and ends?? that is totally unrealistic. How you can seperate them? How can you not see how the play of the DEs has an affect on the play of the DTs. If you have DEs that are forcing double teams, then your DTs are going to benefit. If you have DEs that are forcing the QB to step up in the pocket, then your DTs have a shorter area to cover to get to the QB. I do not understand how you can not see the correlation between the DT and DE. too low expectations? i think not. my expectation from a 2nd round pick is 'realistically' a good to very good player... a starter. if you pick a pro-bowl/HOF player in the second that is above and beyond the expectations but certainly a bonus. to miss at picking a starting player in round 2 is a failure of that pick. this ALSO holds true if you are picking in the bottom half of the 1st round, but.... if you pick in the top 10 of the draft, that player better be something more than good and at the least, very good to EXCELLENT!!! is it going to happen every time? no of course not but when it doesn't the rule STILL holds true as to failure or success of your decision to pick that guy. first... here is what you stated: "First, I personally always felt Tank was over-rated. He played on a DL loaded w/ talent, and I simply never felt he produced near to the level he was expected to." well then what did you mean by saying "Tank was over-rated"? if he wasn't getting "pushed around" or bottled up why do you say he was over rated? over rated by whom? who ever said tank was the best tackle in the nfl? every defensive tackle HAS to be able to stop the run. i understand you saying he isn't a budah but isn't that the point of his talents? he can stop the run AND push in the pocket to get to a qb and use his 300 lb quickness and speed to his advantage. you can't be serious... 2006 PRO BOWL richard seymour - pats - 4 sacks - solo 22 marcus stroud - jags - 2.5 sacks - solo 19 Jamal Williams - bolts - 2 sacks - solo 49 rod coleman - falcons - 6 sacks - solo 20 shaun rogers - lions - 3 sacks - solo 19 tommy harris - bears - 5 sacks - 22 solo =============== tank johnson - 4 sacks - 22 solo tackles am i saying he is a pro-bowl player? not neccessarily but please don't give me he is just a below average over rated player. pulhease. if you want to go tit for tat then fine. the truth of the matter is he was far removed from being a top pick in the draft. again, if you had read my post even reasonably carefully, i NEVER compared player to player quality. only, and let me repeat this, ONLY, did i compare the two between the shadow hampton cast over mcmichel who was a very good player in his right to the shadow and hype harris (deservedly so) cast over tank in chicago. Did I say he was below average? I don't believe I did. I said he was over-rated. You ask who over-rates him? Well, to start w/, how about all those who feel his loss was so tragic to this team. An average player's departure would not mean so much. How about how great of a deal fans made about him. Sorry, I simply never felt he was so great to be worth all the trouble. I personally wanted to cut him long before we did, as I didn't believe he was good enough to warrant the number of chances he received. It isn't like I am saying he sucked. I simply feel that he is an average DT who failed to step up the way I think most had hoped while next to some considerable talent. As for your mention of Hampton/McMichael, chalk it up anyway you want, but your analogy is a reach. Back then, you had a great DT in the shadow of an even greater one. Now? A very average DT in the shadow of a great one. by the way, you don't even have your facts straight. mcmichael only had 2.5 sacks in his 3rd year, and played in NINE games while starting ZERO. And you say I should read your posts better. I believe if you check, I said in his 3rd year "as a starter". He wasn't a starter his rooke year. first: the entire raid on his house was a trumped up bogus load of horse $%!#. to bring in an armoured vehicle, use flash grenades WITH children in the house, for the crap they hoped to find is beyond ridiculous. in any event under those circumstances any responsible law enforcement personel could have defused this entire mess by 1. stopping in and talking to him at his home. 2. if that failed or they decided on another tac, pick him up at work and bring him home with a search warrant. you think they couldn't figure out where he worked??? You want to say the police used too much force. Fine. Personally, I think those who make a big fuss about the police are to easily passing on the reasons they were there in the first place. Neighbors had reported gun fire on numerous occasions. Tank was out back shooting his guns. I really could care less about getting into a gun debate. I live in Texas and guns are part of nearly every discussion. But in my neighbors are shotting guns in their backyard, I don't care what sort of measures the police take. I have kids, and the thought of their playing in the backyards while a neighbor thinks "it would be fun" to shoot his gun in the backyard, meer years from my children.... Well, lets just say I won't be looking at that individual as a victim in the matter. add to this his HUGE criminal results ended up charging him with untagged guns that were registered in arizona (where they should be since this was his home state). are you kidding me? they were in his freakin chicago home. he wasn't packed running around the town. those stupid cops and the idiot media made it sound like they just busted up a terrorist cell. That is all he was charged w/ because discharge of a firearm would have been near impossible to prove, but that was the greater reason he was raided. Further, there was the drug issue. The police had found evidence of drugs prior to the raid, but because his friend claimed all drugs in the house, Tank was not charged w/ that. I do not know you. I do not know where you live, or if you have a family. But if you lived in the burbs w/ a family, and your neighbor had on several occasions been shooting weapons in his backyard, I have a feeling you would not be so lax in your opinion. also i am amazed at your take "Likely thanks to his refusing to take the breathalizer and waiting hours later for a blood sample, he did not register over the legal limit, but at the same time, there was no question he had been out drinking, and then got behind the wheel of a car.", aren't you a lawyer? where i came from there is a huge difference between "likely" and proven facts. no question he had a drink? so what if he did as long as he wasn't drunk driving. the amount in his system was like a single drink hours before if i'm not mistaken (and well could be). First, while I work in the legal field, I am not an attorney. Second, his blood alcohol level was .072 w/ the legal limit being .08. He was barely under. I used a BAC calculator. If Tank (300lb male) drank about 10 beers in a 3 hour stretch, he would have hit that .072. Now I realize there are multiple factors that alter this. What was he drinking? for how long? But the point I am making is, w/ a BAC of .072, he did NOT simply drink a beer, or even just a couple over the course of the night. .072 is a significant level. Further, his BAC was just under the legal limit. As I recall, Tank refused the breathalizer when he was pulled over. He said he would take a blood test, but that is not done on the spot, and most often takes time before it can be administered. Ever moment Tank adds before his test is a moment his BAC decreases. Sorry, but this is an old rule of thumb on what to do if you are pulled over after drinking. First, you refuse the breathalizer. If you think there is a chance you won't pass, you do not take the test. You say you do not trust them, but will take a blood test. If they are quick to set that up, you backout. At this point, in most states, you will lose your liscense for 6 months, but avoid the DWI. If the blood test takes a while before they can administer (which is usually the case) then you can take it depending on how drunk you were. So you can once again make Tank out to be the victim, but he is far from it. He was drinking, and not just a beer or two, and then got behind the wheel of a car. And he did this not that long after being released from prison and telling everyone he would be a choir boy. so on this other BS charge that was dropped, angie says i can't take it anymore? this after he keeps this manning jr. thug who beats the $%!& out of some geek with two or three other athletes???? are you kidding me? I didn't like the DM thing, but it happened prior to becoming a bear, and as far as I know, was his only incident. As opposed to Tank who could not avoid police and bad situations. when this happened, tank is suspended or going to be suspended by the nfl. he is not subject to work at this time, he is in his home state, has not done ANYTHING illegal other than drive late at night. so freakin what? i drive whenever i dammed well want to whether it's 3 p.m. or 3 a.m. he is fired by angie before they even know the facts. what does this sound like to you? Me? It sounds to me like Tank was on his last, last chance, and didn't respect that. He was drinking and driving, not simply driving at 3am. I would also argue that it further an issue of Tank needing to show he knew how to not just avoid trouble, but avoid the situations that often lead to trouble. For celebs, little positive happens on the streets at 3am. It is a situation someone in his situation should have tried better to avoid, and simply reinforced the believe he has no clue how to keep out of those same situations that got him in trouble. i have stated and believe briggs is not a luxery but a serious need. with url's age and injury catching up to him, where do we go? would you feel great with hilly at MLB along with williams on the outside and some mystery backer on the other side? we would seriously get killed. if you don't believe that look at the bengles. they can't keep up with their offense without good backers. you think we could? The difference is you think Urlacher is at the end of his career or something. I think he is simply having a bad year, along w/ most everyone on the team. there is so much wrong with this team right now i don't see us even in the hunt for a superbowl next season. you could reasonably say we are rebuilding yet again, thanks to angie. count the holes and tell me where 1 or 2 FA's will make us a team to beat the pats. if we had THREE first round picks we couldn't get this team on an even keal to do that. can you even tell me who the qb will be?? Beat the Pats? If that is the bar set, I think most every team in the league is in a building mode. I can see moves being made which could get us back into the playoffs. While many moves should be made, I think there are a couple key moves that would get us back rather quickly. One, you need to address the OL. QB, RB, WR do not matter if the OL can not block. I would love to replace them all, but that isn't realistic. The OL is a 2-3 year plan. I would spend money to add Fanaca (or an alternative stud) and my top pick would most likely go to OT. There are a pair of juniors who could come out, and I pray they do, as that would really strengthen the draft for OTs. I would likely start the rookie on the right side for a year (w/ the plan on swapping he and Tait the next). Fanaca inside and a rookie outside starts to fix the problem. Next, I add McNabb. If McNabb is done, then so are we, but I personally think he is not done. Not by any means. Make these personnel moves, along w/ some coaching changes, and I think we can be back in the playoffs next year. "I think it far from a fact Urlacher is on his way out, and his MNF performance would seem to be evidence to the opposite" you are whistling past the graveyard. if he has an arthritic back he is on the serious downward slope. unless this is some minor crap he is spouting, he can't lift to keep strength, he can't even run normally and it's going to get worse quickly. he could coast for a few more years with good talent around him, but if he is paired with rookies and average linebackers don't count on him overcompensating for poorer talent anymore. if you think hilly can replace url, you are in for a serious surprise if that happens. briggs could possibly do it if we change our scheme to match what player we have if needed. Reports have been all over the place w/ regard to Urlacher. The fact is we do not know. But I simply am skeptical w/ the idea he is done. as far as your reference to "Holdman", anyone could have replaced that bum. so what is the point on that? also if angie is worth spit he can find the money NEXT season to sign harris. If Angie is worth a spit, he will not yet sign Harris. It isn't like Harris' price tag is going to go up. He is already stating he should be among the top paid defensive players in the league. He has put himself in Freeney ($30m) tier. His price is far more likely to decrease, particularly since he has not proven he can stay healthy. I would wait to sign him knowing we can always tag him.

1) I don't think Adrian Peterson had too much problem accellerating on the slow surface in Chicago. I've also noticed that Devin Hester seems to be pretty fast in Chicago. In other words, that logic is faulty. Sure, it's great to have that bruiser in the one or two games a year when Soldier field gets messy, if it even happens, but it's probably better to have a guy like Devin Hester who has the potential to change a game on every play. Aside from Jamal Lewis, Lendale White, and maybe one other, the top 15 RBs in the league, statistically by yardage, are all faster, quick-hitter-types. You misunderstand my point. I like homerun hitters too, but my point is that you do not have to be AP/Bush style runner in order to be a franchise RB. I would also point out that Benson has shown ability to hit the big runs. Heck, he breaks off a 60 yarder for a score, and after a couple more good carries, is benched. 2) In all honesty, I wouldn't mind a plodding, blasting, Earl Campbell franchise back. If the guy can keep the chains moving with constant four and five yarders, causing the safeties to creep up and allow the passing game holes, I'm all for it. But usually the guy who does that in college doesn't do that in the pros. That's why the quick-hitters are typically better pro RBs. I simply think Benson (a) was considered a far more quick hitter than what we have seen and ( still can get that form back. This is something I think is key. You have seen Benson, which makes it all too easy to forget, but Benson was not considered a plodder in college. No, there wasn't any mistaking him for AP, but he was not considered slow, or fast "for a power back". He was a 220lb RB that showed solid burst to the hole, exceleration through it, and solid speed in the 2nd level. Coming out of college, he was considered a lot quicker than you are making out. 3) Like I said before, I agree with you. If a team thinks they have a franchise guy on the board, and he is a can't miss, sometimes you gotta go BPA. If you know Peyton Manning is going to turn into Peyton Manning, and you happen to have a Carson Palmer, you might just have to draft Manning and find a trade-partner for Palmer, despite the fact that he is great in his own right. I just didn't think Benson was that guy. And from what I remember about all the debates back then, most thought he was good, but not as special as the Bears' staff apparently thought. As you said, it appears that those of us who thought Benson was a wasted pick are right. With that said, I hope he proves me wrong next year. While I recall opinions on the board being mixed, I do not recall the scouting community being very mixed. Most every scouting report I recall had Benson as a top 5 pick, both in likely draft spot and quality.

Agreed. While everyone wants to say it was Arch that sent Harris packing, it was really more Payne and McGowan. At the time, per all the reports, the staff felt Payne was looking great, and had actually passed Harris on the depth chart. As I recall, we were going to have to keep either Harris or McGowan (Payne had passed both). McGowan was considered a much better special teams player, and had shown a lot of positives on defense. Harris, as I recall, was not considered a great special teams player. Also, Harris had more trade value, and thus was easier to move.

i strongly disagree with this statement. you state we have/had a DL loaded with talent. are you talking about interior linemen or the DL as a whole? it certainly can't be our interior line as angie let the entire squad with the exception of harris and garay, walk. Of coarse I was talking about our DL as a whole. The point was who he played w/, not who was sitting on the bench. tank johnson produced on the level, and more than what is expected, of a 2nd round draft pick. I disagree w/ this. What exactly is your expectation of a 2nd round pick? Dockett was taken after Tank, and he has 8 sacks so far this year. I think you may be setting too low of an expection on our 2nd round draft picks. Though, looking back at some of our 2nd round draft picks, not sure I can blame you. harris was NOT the only player getting double teamed last season in the interior line. When harris was starting, I think Tank was finding himself facing single blocking the vast majority of the time. Last year, through the AZ game when our D was playing lights out and our DL was getting consistent pressure on the QB, Tank was among the few I felt was not getting it done. And that was at a time when I do not believe he was getting double teamed, as too many other players were drawing blocking focus. tank has the quicks getting off the LOS which is very important with a solid push up the middle filling his hole. he was not pushed out anywhere close to what the talent angie replaced him with which is one reason our run defense this season was pathetic. Never said he was getting pushed around. But he was not in there to be a run stopper. W/ the double teams on Harris, he was expected to penetrate, and that is where I feel he didn't get it done. As for who he was replaced w/ (Walker) there is no argument there. Adams easily has outplayed Walker, as did the the rookie Toeaina this past week. Walker has been a bust, but that has little to do w/ Tank. tank also has some speed that can move him down the line to make the tackles out of his area and flush a qb. He was supposed to have the ability to get to the QB, but I simply didn't see it. players like tank are the guys you HOPE turn out this good with a later first day pick. a situation similar to a steve mcmichel being overshadowed by hampton. Again, I think you under-value picks beyond the 1st round. Also, as he was taken 15th in the 2nd round, I would not call him a "later first day pick", which to me at least, would imply at least a 3rd round pick. As for the McMichael comparison, are you freaking kidding me? Yea, Hampton got more glory, but at the same time, McMichael did FAR more than Tank. In McMichael's 3rd year as a starter, he had 8.5 sacks, followed by: 10, 8, 8, 7, 11.5, 7.5, 4, 9, 10.5 & 6. Tanks is so far from McMichael's league it isn't even close. i still have to say that what tank was charged and used to release him with was total BS. you can thank these stupid cops for the amount of publicity tank got because they had to justify a complete waste of a huge amount of taxpayers money on a personal vendetta. if you don't believe me look at the charges. the only really stupid one on tanks part is the going out after hours to get rid of his live-in friend which violated his probation for doing basically nothing. even the trumped up charge in arizona was totally bogus. believe me i am not for coddling punks and thugs in the nfl and certainly not a homer, but this crap was to the extreme in his case and in my opinion based upon his disrespect of authority in his first charge. we NEVER should have released him. Disagree again. While I can understand your opinion that some, or even all, of the chargers were not major, at the same time I think it was more an issue of him simply lacking respect enough to stay out of trouble, or even out of situations likely to result in trouble. While going to the bar hours after being released from jail is a great example, so it the incident that ended his career w/ the bears. His being out late, and driving after drinking, soon after release from a prison sentence, was simply the final straw. Likely thanks to his refusing to take the breathalizer and waiting hours later for a blood sample, he did not register over the legal limit, but at the same time, there was no question he had been out drinking, and then got behind the wheel of a car. If this was his only incident, it was be a bad decision, but not close to one likely to end his career w/ the bears. But it was not his only incident, and came after being told by the team he was on his last, final chance, and told he needed to be a good boy. Heck, he told the commish he was going to be a model citizen. Sorry, but his off-field decision making was so poor, that he was simply too great of a distraction. Further, it should be pointed out that he was due to sit on the bench 1/2 the season, so it is further questionable how much he would have changed things if he had remained a bear. another thing i do not agree with you is briggs. (another post about trading players) if we dump briggs this offseason we are in serious trouble with our defense. he is a young probowl player no matter what anyone spins the sitation as. that is NOT over-rated for a young guy to make it multiple years as all-pro and/or pro bowl player. Did I say he was over-rated? I don't think I did. If he leaves the bears, and were signed by a bad team to be the main focus of a team, I think that team may be disappointed. But that is frankly irrelavent. On our team, his value is great. Whether he is over-rated or not league wide doesn't matter, as his value for OUR team is not over-rated. At the same time, my argument against keeping him is based on money. (a) IMHO, if we sign him, it will take away from our ability to help other areas. I believe you are VERY high on fixing the OL. Well, that is going to cost both money and draft picks, and if we give Briggs greater than $20m guaranteed, I think it unlikely we will spend big on the OL. Call it cheap ownership, cap management, or whatever you want, but I simply do not believe we would sign Briggs to the largest contract in bear history, only to then spend a great some on other areas of need, and greater need IMHO. ( While Harris is under contract for another year, we are going to have to begin looking into a new deal for him. We just gave both corners big bucks. We just gave A.Brown a new deal and Wale is still under his large deal, as is Urlacher. I simply question whether we could sign Briggs to as massive of a deal as he wants, and then w/ in a year, turn around and sign Harris to an even greater deal. © While Briggs is a great player for us, the reality is OLB is not the hardest position to replace, especially when paired w/ Urlacher. CB and DL are far harder, and more expensive, to replace than LB. While I am NOT saying any LB we replaced Briggs w/ would be as good, I think we can replace him w/ a competant player. And in doing so, we could be saving $20m to spend in other areas, w/o creating a great weakness. Again, we will likely have a drop at LB, but I do not believe it would become a weakness. At the same time, we would have the money to allocate to other weaknesses to hopefully make them strengths. if anyone couldn't see the difference in play when he sits and williams plays is just not looking close enough. url is definately on his way out of the nfl with the cronic back problems. his play will suffer and that is a fact. that leaves us with an average hillenmeyer, who plays situationally, and who? williams? also if we let briggs go, who COULD play the middle if url is out, who steps in? this reverts a very good linebacking corp, which is essential to lovies crappy cover 2, to mediocre at best. I think it far from a fact Urlacher is on his way out, and his MNF performance would seem to be evidence to the opposite. You say Williams can't replace Briggs (not to mention Okwo) but there was a point in time when it was wondered who would replace Holdman too. Again, while there well may be a drop, OLB is simply not the hardest position in the game to find quality. You ask who would play inside, but Briggs doesn't fill that role now. When Urlacher has gone down, we moved Hunter inside, not Briggs, and then replaced Hunter on the outside. If Brigg is gone, I think it goes from being maybe the best in the league, to a good one. At the same time, if we can use that money to make pure weaknesses into good or even strengths, I think it a solid trade off. As for Lovie's cover two, it is actually the DL above everything that is key, as the key to his scheme is front line pass rush. So that takes me back to Harris. What if signing Briggs prevents you from keeping Harris. A pass rushing DT is far and away a greater piece to Lovie's system than the WLB.

Not a big fan of your moves, Time to liquidate some assets to address the big issues. Problem is, the more you "liquidate", the more holes you create which will need to be addressed. 1. Let Briggs go. He is good...but not as good as he thinks...the D was bad this year with him here IMO that means he isnt a difference maker. Besides Chicago area uteruses could use a break. Agreed. While I like Briggs and feel he is a big part of this defense, at the same time, I simply do not believe we can afford to keep him and feel we need to use that money elsewhere. 2. Trade Dez Clark...use him to move up in the draft if need be. Disagree. I would rather we create an offenses more focused on the TEs we have. WR is a big problem, but if we traded away Clark, we would create an even greater need at WR. If we keep Clark, we might lessen the WR problem by utilizing our two pass catching TEs better. 3. Trade Alex Brown. Same scenario. Hell no. Anderson proved little by way of capability as a starter. As a starter, he was abused on run downs and lost his explosion on passing downs. Not only do I not trade Brown, but I return him to the starting role. Also, if you trade him, you take one of our few areas of strength and create a weakness. The points of 2 and 3 are to clear out where there is depth...and use some of that to obtain additional picks or pick value. Nice idea, but in reality, you would only be creating more holes. If we traded Brown, you can bet Angelo would be looking to draft another DE. 4. Dump Miller, do not re-sign Reuben. No question. 5. Trade Kruetz. Yes. He is aging and declining...and still has value. Time to make the move is now. He also gets his butt whooped by beefy DTs...which is a problem for us at least 4 times a year with Detroit and Minny. Perhaps he could go into MMA...he does have a killer jaw breaker move. Hell no. While I will not argue that Kreutz is not playing as well as he has, he is still better than most. Once again, by trading him you create yet another hole and weakness. We have serious issue on the OL, and you would only make them worse by trading away Kreutz. Between Kruetz, Alex and Dez you clearly should find some benefits in draftpicks, prospects and cap room. THe O is crap and needs to total retooling. Even if you do trade them, I think you may be over-valuing them. No clue what the return would be, but I doubt it would be great, particularly as none of coming off great seasons and their value is down. 6. at WR - dump Moose - let Berrian walk. Keep either Bradley or Davis. I prefer Bradley. Hester is a guaranteed start in my world. While I like the idea, WR is a current weak area, and are only making it worse. Likely we let Berrian walk and keep Moose one more year. 7. Be open to bidding for Berrian and Turner the Burner. Play if the market is not as hyper for their services as those players would hope. Absolutely we will be open to re-signing Berrian, but I doubt the price will be right. Turner is a nice idea, but while few are sold on Benson, I think the OL is more important to spend the money on. Turner may well be great, but behind our OL, I doubt he would do much. We need to address the OL, then see what Benson can do behind a new OL. 8. Take the winnings from the trades to draft no less than 3 O-Linemen. Agree we need to draft OL, but I think it optimistic to believe we will find three starters in the draft. Further, I doubt we get much by way of 1st day picks for the players you are trading, and I doubt we find many starters for the OL day two. 9. Sign one FA lineman...nobody over 27/28 years of age. The OL I want more is older (Fanaca). While age is a factor, I think you simply have to look at the player as a hole. Miller was not simply old, but well known to be on the decline when we signed him. Similar w/ Brown, who still could play but not at the same level. Fanaca is older, but has shown no signs of beginning a decline.

There are a few I disagree w/ I agree w/ the majority, but some I either disagree w/, or simply have issue w/. 1. You cut your second-best defensive tackle because he can't stay out of trouble and, while you won't miss the trouble, you will miss him. First, I personally always felt Tank was over-rated. He played on a DL loaded w/ talent, and I simply never felt he produced near to the level he was expected to. W/ Tommie Harris either out or playing hurt this year, I doubt Tank would have made that great of a difference. Second, while it didn't workout, this was an area we at least did address in adding Walker and Adams, and personally, I think Adams played well. 2. You keep your prized first-round draft choice on the field in the second quarter of a meaningless final exhibition game long after every other key offensive player called it a night, and he injures a knee that takes a month to heal. While the injury sucked, I never felt it was the great mistake to have him in there. While he was a 1st round pick, he was a rookie and needed as many reps as possible to develop. I realize the starters had been pulled, but at the same time (a) he was not a starter and ( TE is not a position that will suffer a greater chance of injury w/ the other starters out. For example, it would not be smart to have your starting RB or QB in the game when the starting OL is out, but TE is not a position that should be under any greater chance of injury w/ the starters out. It sucked, but I simply do not see it as having been a mistake. 3. You pull the plug on the quarterback three games after he started Super Bowl XLI. Yes, Rex started the SB, but let's not pretent that his 3 poor games to start the year came out of no where, and his benching was based solely on that. It was an extension of many bad games seen in the 2nd half last year as well. Further, many believe Rex looked better when he returned from the bench, so it could be just as easily argued that Rex benefited from the benching. 4. You make a series of odd personnel decisions that include benching a Pro Bowl alternate at defensive end This one kills me. I have heard so many say this, but while it didn't work out, was it really the wrong move. Anderson was a pass rushing monster last year. While it looks now like he is best as a situational pass rush specialist, at the same time, I think it was very logical to make the move. 5. You suffer too many injuries to overcome, especially on defense I simply call BS on this one. While there is no question injuries hurt this team, I do not accept it as an excuse. Buffalo suffered more injuries than we did, and had less talent to start w/, and yet played better on defense than we. Further, and I have said this before, even w/ all the injuries, we still had enough talent on the field that we should have been better. While the injuries at DT hurt, Anderson, Brown and Wale still present a ton of talent upfront. We went into the year w/ potentially the best LB trio, and they all played every game. There were many injuries in the secondary, but if the front 7 did a better job of getting to the QB, the issues in the secondary may not have been felt as much. To me, the issues on defense were far beyond simply the injuries we suffered.

I am not a fan of Haugh's at all, but I do not believe the article was written as an, "I told you so". He listed reasons for the bears decline. That isn't to say he saw each and every one of these as being negative at the time, but in looking back, these are the things he said hurt the team.

This is the only valid and acceptable answer to the scenario. I hate it, but it's true. One can't fault an organization for attempting to draft that special player. It just sucks that the Saints hit on Bush, the Vikings got a jackpot in AP, and the Bears crapped-out with Benson. And, despite the fact that I agree in majority with your parallels, notice the one major difference in the "special player" category: game breaking ability. Benson was a stud coming out of college, but there is no way in hell I thought he was one of those "special" talents that the Bears simply had to have. In fact, I have a hard time believing anyone thought that at the time. I watched his highlight reel stuff, and saw a ton of his games on TV, but never did I think he was something other than a great college player who would probably turn into a good-to-very good pro RB. Okay, lets us then skip the rest, and agree to disagree on whether RB was a need, or to what level. Let us simply say RB was not a need, and go from there. You did not then, and absoluteldy not now, believe Benson ever had the look of that "special back". While I understand that, and it is your opinion, it was not the consensus. The consensus then was that he was in fact a franchise back. That he was the sort of player you could not only use as a workhorse, but one you could build an offense around. I know the style RB you like, and the examples listed above (Bush/AP) absolutely fit into your ideal RB. One w/ the potential to hit a homerun on every carry, but that is not the only style franchise back, at least not to most, especially in Chicago where you play the majority of your games on a slower surface and often in bad weather. I remember some years ago when Tomlinson was in the draft. Some felt he would be that special back, while others were far from certain. He came from a smaller school, weaker competition, and a non-pro style offense. Many of his runs were pitches, and he had not proven himself as an inside rusher or receiver. Hard to imagine that now, but it was true then. Regardless, many scouted him as a franchise RB, thus why SD was willing to pass on Vick. I think they got the better end of the deal, especially since they also got Brees w/ Atlanta's other pick. So I go back to this. While you never felt Benson was that franchise back, many did, including our staff. As of this moment, it appears they were wrong, but that doesn't mean the thinking behind the pick was wrong. Only the scouting. While I personally like to factor need in the draft, as I am not a pure "best player available", but at the same time, if you believe there is a franchise player available, you take him. The only exception I would make is if you already have a franchise tier player at that position. For example, right now CB is far from a need, but if we had a player we were looking at who we felt was the next Deion Sanders or Champ Bailey, I would be hard pressed to pass. Not close to a need, but sometimes you simply can't pass.

Agreed. Due to injuries, we are already playing quite a few young players, but there are some more we need to see. QB - Orton - Regardless how he plays. RB - Wolfe WR - Hass, Bradley, Hester TE - Olsen OL - I would like to see Beekman and St.Clair DL - Toeaina, Anderson LB - Jamar Williams DB - McBride, Graham.

Jamar had one solo and 3 assists, so he was definitely in there for more than a play or two. Quite a few times, Minny only used one WR, lining up two TEs, a FB and a RB. Anytime they did this, we countered by sending in Jamar Williams in place of Vasher/McBride. There were other times McGowan moved to FS, DM took a seat, and we used Jamar Williams as a 4th LB instead of a SS. I do not know exactly how many plays Jamar was in there for. But I did not think he played well, and several of AP's bigger runs were created by Jamar being on the outside, and moving inside, leaving his cut back assignment.

Reminds me of years ago when Jauron called for us to take a knee on 4th down to run down the clock, not realizing the clock would automatically stop w/ the change of possession.

I'm not going to knock AP too much for his running. We have a weak OL and were facing the best run defense in the game. W/ Orton at the helm, it isn't like Minny feared the pass either. And frankly, I never got caught up in the AP hype. So many felt he could start for many other teams, and I never did. So to me, his running is what it is. Average. I like what he does as a receiver. He catches the ball well, and showes vision and good moves to squeeze out extra yards. Pass blocking though.... This is an area he is supposed to be so good at, and I simply have not seen it all year. When he tries to block straight up, he gets knocked over or pushed aside. So instead, he most often dives at the ankles, doing even less. He is the anti Benson. Benson did not always make the right read, but when he did, I more often than not saw him flat out standup the defender. Can we put AP's mind in Benson's body. And before any here add it, I will. Can we add AP's heart as well.

I have no issue w/ Hester being in there on offense. The season is over, and at this point, our best coarse is development. As bad as Jamar Williams played, I like that he was on the field. I like that I saw Bradley. I would have liked Hass in there too.

Disagree. One. While TJ did not have a bad year, it wasn't believed he was a special back either. A servicable, or even good back, maybe, but not a special back. Two. To that point, TJ had not shown an ability to stay healthy, nor had he proven capable of being a workhorse. The 240 carries he had that year were nearly double his career high. Three. It is very easy to say it was a mistake today as we have seen Benson play, and at this point, it is hard to even think much less recall what was said about his them. Benson was a very highly rated RB. He was considered a special RB. In fact, as I recall, several publications had him being one of the best RBs to hit the draft in years. RB was not our #1 need, but at the same time, you hate to pass on a player you feel is a franchise player that can carry the franchise because he have a decent player at that position. The year we drafted Urlacher, MLB was not our top need as Minter was still a servicable enough MLB, but it was felt that Urlacher was simply that special sort of player you can't pass on. I doubt many question that pick. I would put it simply this way. If Benson became the special player he was hyped up to be, I think you would be hard pressed to find those who would argue his selection. NO had Deuce McAlister and drafted Bush, who they felt was special, and few questioned it. Minny had Chester Taylor, who had just rushed for over 1,200 yards and a 4 ypc average. He proved he was a workhorse w/ his 300+ carries, and added 42 catches as well. Yet that did not stop them from drafting AP. I would argue that Chester Taylor had proven himself in Minny far more than TJ in Chicago. Would you argue Minny was wrong to draft AP? It is easy to look back and say it was a mistake, but IMHO, you would not be saying that today if Benson had developed into the player so many scouts felt he would be.

The good (yes, there were some good things, just not many) 1. Toeaina. First game, matching up w/ a pair of the best inside OL in the game (Hutch & Burk) and he not only held his own, but made some plays and busted some runs, forcing AP to alter coarse into the arms of waiting tacklers. Walker who? 2. Maynard. He had some huge kicks. One was a huge 55 yarder w/ great hangtime from our own 3 yard line. Several other big kicks, and w/ great hangtime. 3. Numerous areas of defense. We passed up the cover 2 (as we should have the first game) and stacked the box. We did well against their run game, made plays and forced turnovers. 4. Coverage units did a great job getting downfield and limiting Minny as well. As poor as our offense played, the score could have been much worse if not for the great play by the special teams. The bad. 1. Jamar Williams. He did not look good last night. I believe he played much of the game, as we gave up a safety and played a 4-4-3 alignment, adding the extra LB in the box. On both AP's long gain of the night, and a cut back TD run, Jamar left his assignment. Jamar is supposed to stay outside to prevent just the sort of cut backs AP so often uses, but he went inside and was out of position. Can't write him off based on one game, but last night sure gave little confidence in the idea of his replacing Briggs w/o too great of a dropoff. 2. Once again, tackling. While better for the most part, as usual, it seems we come up w/ blown tackles when we need to stops most. That long catch and run saw McGowan make a pathetic diving tackle attempt as he bounced off the receiver, also knocking his own man off. 3. Blitz pickup. For so long I heard about how great AP was at blitz pickup. Much of the year I watched him and simply do not see it. I will say that he does make the right read far more than Benson, but he simply does a poor job of engaging. AP too often simply dives at the defenders ankles, only to see the defender jump over him and barely lose momentum on his way to the QB. AP reads the blitz well enough, but simply is not strong enough of a blocker to keep the QB clean. The Ugly 1. Penalties. The defense had to play a perfect game, and simply could not afford to give Minny free yards. On the other side, our offense was seriously out-matched, and could not afford all the false starts and holding penalties, putting themselves in down/distance they simply were not good enough to convert. 2. Cont off the above, but at the end of the half, the late hit on Tillman was inexcusable. That extra 15 yards was huge, as it allowed Minny to get into field position for a last second FG. W/o that penalty, Minny would have been forced to make a deep pass in order to get in field goal range, but because of that penalty, Minny only needs a short pass. That 3 points wasn't the difference in the game, but hurt none the less. 3. Something i did not understand was the end of the game. Minny is taking a knee to run out the clock. We had one timeout left. After the final knee, we could have used the TO to stop the clock w/ around 8-10 seconds left. W/ Devin Hester on the team, why would you not take the TO. Even if they kick away from him, in doing so, you have the chance of getting improved field position. Point is, anything can happen. W/ the time remaining, we would have had an opportunity for a punt return, as well as one play, depending on how long the punt play went. Very unlikely we would have done anything w/ the extra play, but why simply give up. 4. While the D played pretty well most of the game, at the end, the failed. After a great punt and play, we had them at the 2 yard line. We should have been licking our chops thinking either safety, or at minimum, making a stand and getting good field position. Instead, on the first play, we give up a 28 yard run, as well as another 1 down. Minny moves the ball to mid field, using up nearly 5 minutes, and our offense takes over at the 10.

I said Babich should go, not that he will go. I know Babich is going no where. He is Lovie's boy, and to fire Babich is to admit there is a problem w/ Lovie's system. Loview's ego will not allow that. My point is Babich "should" go. While I personally hate the cover two, our problems on defense go beyond the system. Much of it is our in game playcalling on defense, where I feel we are simply getting out coached. So often we just happen to be in exactly the wrong alignment for what the offense runs. Or we just happen to blitz the corner when it is a quick screen to the WR that corner would otherwise cover. Once in a while is one thing, but too often we seem to be calling the exact opposite of what we need on that down. Tackling is worse this year than ever. Discipline seems worse than ever. Gap assignment. I could easily go on, and these are coaching beyond scheme. Babich has shown nothing IMHO. I have no problem ripping Lovie for much, but there is still plenty to blame on Babich. Now again, Babich is going no where. But point wasn't what will happen, but what should.

You asked. I'll answer........ Why is it that the Bears get at least three false starts every game? One, because our team lacks discipline, which goes back to the coaches. Two, because our OL is not good, and was playing a very good DL. You often seen penalties when lines are outmatched. Why is it that Tommie Harris gets one offsides every game? Like it or not, this is something bear fans will have to live w/. A huge aspect of Tommie's "game" is timing the snap. Often when he blows up the DL, it isn't purely based on ability, but also because he timed the snap and came off the ball at the same time as the OL, which gives him an advantage. If you force him to be more conservative and avoid the penalties, you will also likely see a reduction in the playmaking. Why is it that a safety misses a huge tackle at least once every game? One, this team in general has weak, very weak, tackling discipline. We don't practice tackling in our soft practices, and this leads to weak technique. It isn't just the safeties, as I saw plenty of missed tackles by the LBs too. Two, because our coaching staff tells the players to go for the strip so much that they tend to miss tackles. We have seen it all year w/ DM.

Couple comments regarding Robertson First, you are assuming we would have taken him. It was the most commonly held belief, but FAR too often I have seen drafts where everyone thought a team would do one thing, only to see them do another. There is no absolute Robertson would have been the pick. While DT was a need, so were several other positions. I believe CB was a need, and Newman was there. I remember talk of some other players as well. Second, it has been said many times before, but just because a player didn't workout for one team does not mean he would not have worked out for another. Maybe Robertson would have been a bust for us, but then again, we play a different scheme, and have different personnel that would have surrounded him, and he may have been good. Third, while I was not so much against our trade down, I was sick over the two players we ended up taking, and to this day still believe we got hosed on our 1st pick. Most of the talk had us trading down expecting to draft Jimmy Kennedy, but there was a run on DTs early, and he didn't fall to us, which is why we dropped another slot when NE offered. Ironically, Kennedy was a bust too, and further ironic, is now w/ us. For the record, the player I really wanted w/ that first pick was Polamalu. Man would that have been nice.

Babich & Turner should be fired That will not happen, but is what should happen. Specifically looking at Turner though, yes, he should be fired. I would give the following reasons: (1) Talent development. Part of his job is to develop the talent he has, in particular, the QB. Who on offense could be said to have developed? Rex seemed to regress from last year, and continued to make many of the same mistakes as in the past. Berrian was expected to really take the next step, but he took regressed dramatically. Benson? OL? Not only did nearly the entire offense seem to lack development, but many/most seemed to regress. (2) Hester. This should be as subpart of the above, but to me, Hester is a prime example. Maybe Hester is just that dumb, but just look at him when he plays offense. He usually has no clue where to even lineup. That is on the coaching. (3) Maximizing strengths and hiding weaknesses. Let see. We run Wolfe inside? We have a 6'5 1st round pick TE, and forget him both in the red zone, as well as on hail mary plays. Huh? We all see that Benson does not run sweeps well, yet we continue to run those plays. Our OL is awful, yet we continue to ask Rex to hold the ball instead of using more 3 step drop plays. So often, it is like we continue to pound away w/ our weaknesses, while ignoring our strengths. (4) Playcalling. I don't think I even need to provide examples, as we all can think of so many. (5) How we have handled our RB position. Sorry Benson haters, but it was a joke. The way we rotated our backs, we made ourselves too predictable. Also, several times Benson started running well, only to be benched. Turner deserves to be let go, w/o question in my mind. The question I do have though is our ability to find a competent replacement.

Maybe, but there are always two sides to a story. Briggs may very well be an A-hole. I have to wonder though. I mean, it says he provided her a car and a credit card. It also says he at some point took them away. Why? Was she being unreasonable in demands? Was she abusing the credit card? Sorry, but too often you see women that hook up w/ pro players and feel they hit paydirt. They believe they are entitled to the same life as the player. Personally, I disagree. Frankly, I also disagree the child automatically has the right to the same wealth as well. $250 a week is low, no question, but Briggs side also said she turned down a settlement offer and is looking for not only child support, but support for herself. It very well could be that she is trying to not only feed her child, but become rich herself in the process.

Also, the tip for the outline mode was great, but is there any chance the post can be numbered in outline mode? More difficult having to look through the date/time of each post to know if a new/recent post has been added.

That seriously may be the most upsetting aspect of the "what do we do in the offseason" discussion. Last year, in the offseason, we were looking at depth. We were looking at needs for future years. We were looking at few actual upgrades for starting positions. Most positions were set, and new players were more likely to bring depth and special teams. Now, it feels like we need help everywhere. QB - Situation is flat out ugly. RB - Even Benson supporters like myself see the need for, at minimum, a better #2 who can provide legit competition. WR - As ugly as QB. TE - Among the only positions fans can be content w/ OG - Metcalf is so bad, a one armed Brown was better. Our issue at LG is so bad, Garza actually looks good. OT - Tait has been abused this year, and Miller is done. We have little to no depth. DE - We have talent, but need better coaching to utilize that talent. DT - Do these guys know who Rusty Jones is? We need health and better depth. LB - Briggs is going to want a fortune, and at a time when we have so many other needs. Urlacher is hurting, and our rookie LB just lost a year. S - As bad as the offense is, this may be our worst area. That is telling. We do not have anyone worthy to start OR BACKUP. CB - Put this up there w/ TE as a rare position to be content w/, especially w/ McBride showing positive things. P - I think he is playing great. His numbers would be far better if our special teams guys could better locate the ball inside the 20. K - I would love to see kickoffs go further, but as long as he continues to convert FGs, I will give him a pass. HC - I think he is a joke, but no chance he is gone. OC - May be gone, and it would be deserved, but I have little faith we can find an upgrade. DC - Babbich should be gone, but because he is buds w/ Lovie, he is more likely safe. Too bad. His unit went from best to worst. DL, OL & WR position coaches should be gone as well.