nfoligno

I say that based on age and injuries. That doesn't mean his play is really on the decline, but he is at an age where I think it valid to begin expecting such. Further, w/ the injury he suffered last year, I think it fair to debate a potential decline as well. Hey, I am saying I would not draft a LB. I am saying that even IF Urlacher goes down, I would not do it. Urlacher very well may have several years of stud play remaining, but (a) I understand the logic in a potential decline and ( I still would not spend a high 1st round pick to replace him.

2. Urlacher shows signs of breaking down...or Briggs similarly. Okay, I'll play along. What if Urlacher breaks down. Not sure I go along w/ the same thinking w/ Briggs, as he has shown no signs of such, and thus the what if seems like a reach. I still would not draft a LB in the 1st. (a) If you take Urlacher out of the D, it may not be as great, but it is still loaded w/ pro bowl and all-pro talent. Offense is not even loaded w/ starters. ( One of the few things Angelo has shown an ability to do is find defensive talent in the draft, particularly after the 1st round. I trust Angelo to use later picks to replace Urlacher more than I trust him to improve the offense w/ later draft picks. © It may not have always been true, but I think LBs are more plentiful and less expensive in FA than OL, WR or QB. Even OGs are getting ridiculously expensive in FA. WRs and QBs always were. LBs however is a position I think you can still find solid bargains in FA. 3. And/or, there are no other clear cut beter players at the OL or QB or WR. None? No OT, OG, QB or WR rated close? If we have a guy at one of those positions w/in a couple slots of where we grade the LB, I go w/ the others. I find it hard to believe there would be nothing even close. But lets say for a moment that is true. Well, if he is the sure thing stud you believe, then we would be in a great position to trade down. Also, you make mention of LB depth...I personally do not see that depth, can you expound? Jamal Williams? He is a player who seems loaded w/ potential, but simply lacking an opportunity. Its one thing when you have a reserve player who can't beat out an average starter, but can we fault Williams for not beating out Briggs? We have tried it already buy building an elite D, w/o building an offense. It hasn't worked. I think we have to work very hard now trying to build the offense. Even if you take Urlacher out of the picture, we still have a defense loaded w/ studs, and locked up w/ long term deals. On offense, we are not even loaded w/ solid starters, much less studs, much less w/ them locked up long term. I simply see little logic to drafting a defensive player next year over an offensive player.

One, even w/ the cap, you can still be a cheap team. Signing bonus money is a key here. A cheap team doesn't shell out $15m bonuses. Prior to Phillips and Hatley, there is simply no question we ran the team, from a player standpoint, from the cheap seats. The team simply refused to shell out the upfront dollars. But a change did in fact happen. When Mikey and Wanny were running the show, do you think we would have spent the sort of money we have on players? Two, You say a gun was to our heads, but the fact remains, we spend big to keep our coach. I would also point out that we cut Wanny w/ a year or two remaining on his deal. I simply don't think we are cheap here. We have a GM. That wasn't always the case. And if you look at the coaching staff, we have a full group. Some cheaper teams don't have position coaches for every position, or try to simply go light here. Three, what admin costs are you thinking of? The bears were among the first to build a state of the art training facility. Not long ago, and again, after hatley took over, the team built up one of the largest scouting departments in the league. Is it still at the same level? I don't know. But I see no reason to assume different. I just am not sure what admin costs you are talking about. I have never heard about our team having to travel by bus, or staying at motel 6s. I have never heard players complain their meals are light. Just not sure what admin costs you think we might be skimping on. Look, the reputation was earned. Well earned. But while some choose to live in the past, it doesn't take must to look around and see how much money this teams spends. You talk about admin costs, but how much money are we really talking about? The teams shells out tens of millions of dollars every offseason on players. I question a team being cheap by saying they might try to save a few hundred thousand on this or that when they are spending tens of millions in other areas that prove otherwise.

Sorry, but I am simply not a huge college football fan. I follow college mostly for the NFL draft. I don't get too interested in players who are before they appear ready to enter the league. Texas colleges would be the exception (and Notre Dame) as I can't help but to follow them.

Not to knock the kid, but I will be sick if we draft a LB. Urlacher may be on the decline, but we have depth at LB. On the other hand, we have an offense in dire need of immediate starters.

Who?

We absolutely can blame Lovie. It is not the same on offense. Lovie is a defensive background coach. He can't meddle in the offense as he can the defense, as he simply doesn't know offense. Defense is another story. I would further point out that Babich is running Lovie's scheme. If Babich fails to run it effectively, then why should we not expect Lovie to step in. As for our owners being cheap, sorry, but I will continue to argue this is a joke. You are going back 20 years to make a point. In the last decade, the ownership (through Miller) have stepped up and have spent about as many as any team out there. We shell out $5m/yr for a coach. We shell out upper tier bonus dollars to bring in FAs (Wale, Tait, Moose) as well as to keep our owns. If we were still a cheap organization, as some want to continue to believe, we would not have been able to keep the coach and players we have. Now we can argue day and night whether these were good decisions, but that is not relevant. The relevant point is that we have stepped up and spent money. The arguments that this is a cheap organization simply are no longer valid.

As I told conner, I was saying the D was pathetic, not his remarks. I understand what you are saying, but see my previous post. - Should we really count so much on Brown and Dusty, two players we have not been about to count on thus far? - Harris being out hurts, but don't we still have loads of talent? - If this were the only time I saw our D look bad, that would be one thing, but this D has been embarrased all preseason, not to mention last year. - While we had a couple guys out, weren't we playing a bunch of backups? They had their backup QB and RB in the game, and their top receiver was out too. So we may have held back a couple starters, but so did Cle. Sorry, but when I look at the VERY mediocre QBs and RBs that have been killing our starting D this year, I just think the excuses are less.

Yes, I was talking about the D, and not posters comments on the D, being pathetic.

I would say there is plenty of reason to worry, but that doesn't mean we write off the season, or start looking to pickup extra hours on Sundays.

Depends. While not all together probable, what if (a) Orton actually develops this year and looks good. You might say if that happens, we are likely to win more games, but if the D plays as they have, that is far from a sure thing. ( Forte develops well and becomes a very good RB. © Williams comes back later in the year, and looks like the stud he was drafted to be. One of the young OL develops and looks good. There is no question I would rather an OL pick, but it also depends on value. What if there simply aren't good options. On the other hand, if we have the QB and RB positions settled, and there is a stud WR there? I am not big on drafting WR in the 1st, but I do see the benefit if you are set at QB and RB. OL is still a priority, but I would not write it off today. If Orton does develop, then I think the priorities should be (a) OL to protect him and ( provide him w/ weapons.

Supposedly Ron Rivera & Lovie disagreed often, which is why Rivera was let go. So we bring in Lovie's guy. So the defense sucked last year. Injuries were the excuse. In pre-season we've been close to 100% healthy: I said Babich was a problem all last year. Injuries hurt us, but I do not believe injuries explained the extreme level our defense tanked. Even w/ the injuries, we still had quite a few studs on D, and yet stunk. Defenses with less quality than what we had healthy simply put, did better. 1. In 4 pre-season games has our #1 defense seen a 4 & out? Have we had a turn-over? Assume you mean 3 and out, and I can't give you a question. To make you point worse, can we think for a moment about the QBs (not to mention RBs) who have shredded our 1st string D? Croyle, Frye, O'Sullivan & Quinn. That would be 4 backup QBs that shredded our 1st string D. Take a moment to think about that one for a moment. 2. Every team that we have played in the pre-season has used misdirection plays. All four games we've over-pursued in the wrong direction & gotten burned. Whatever happened to "staying in our gaps." I rarely here the players say that any more. No discipline. Poor angles. Poor recognition. Poor tackling. Blame the players, fine, but this is not a new problem, and thus one I think we have to consider the coaching and/or scheme. 3. Under Babbich, we do seem to get to the quarterback more often, but for some reason it tends to leave our secondary more open. Quarterbacks simply do not make mistakes when the pressure is coming. I know that doesn't make sense. When other teams bring the house on us, bad things happen. When we bring the house, good things happen to the other team. Honestly, I am not sure I agree we get to the QB more. Sacks in 2006 and 2007 were about even, just distributed differently. Stats aside, I simply am not sure we have generated so much more pressure under babich. 4. Tonight Cleveland's #1 o-linemen flat-out man-handled our defense. Should it also be pointed out that, prior to tonight, Cle's OL (and offense in general) had been getting ripped for poor play. Many began to question if last year was a fluke, as Cle's OL was looking very average to below average. Then they face us and look all-pro? It's easy to make the argument that it just pre-season, but Bear's radio reported the defensive players were pissed at being scored on in consecutive drives. Something ain't working. More often then not, what works or doesn't work in pre-season, does carry over. As I recall, they were pissed off heading into the last game too, and I believe we saw similar/same results. Lovie's under contract for 4 more years. Most of our defensive starters are under contract. Something needs to change. No clue what to even say to this. As you said, Lovie is under contract 4 more years. Hard to see his going bye bye. As for Babich, will Angelo v Babich invoke an Angelo v Shoop like situation?

Mike Brown, Dusty, and Tommie did not play tonight. No excuse - I'm just saying. I know you are "just saying" but that was pathetic. (a) Mike Brown is a player this defense should be prepared to play w/o. ( Dusty is not a player this defense has counted on, and while we all hope for much from him, the reality is he has done thing do date. © harris is a stud, but is the defense so reliant on him. Also, hasn't the D been getting embarrased w/ Harris in the lineup thus far?

I think you might be thinking of Damon Shelton. He was a very good run blocking FB. He was a pretty solid pass blocking FB. But he was one dimensional, and not considered much of a runner or receiver. We then got Pritchett, who was considered a good receiving FB and decent pass blocking FB, but average to below average run blocking FB, and not a runner himself. You can double check my memory, but I think the two overlapped a season or two, and then the team let Shelton go, choosing to go w/ a more versatile FB. Pritchett lasted a year or so more, and we then brought in Mckie, who has been our guy for the last 4 years. Mixed in w/ this, though I can't recall the year, we traded w/ Wash for Bryan Johnson, but he could never stay healthy, and never made an impact. Somewhat sad is we actually drafted a pretty good FB back in 1999, in Jim Finn. He was a 7th round pick that year, and I don't think even made the 53 man roster. He signed w/ Indy, and I believe was their #1 FB for several year, then went to NYG as a FA, where again, I think he was a starter. As I recall, he was a pure blocking FB, but he was solid, and did well after we cut him. I am not saying he was great, but its just a bit sad IMHO that we have spent years w/o a good FB, and let one slip through our hands.

Um, where in that article does it say DM is our #1 nickel, or starting nickel? IMHO, if DM is a backup nickel, then nothing in the below article would be a lie, would it? If it was just some reporters speculation, that would be one thing, but DM seemed to open the door w/ his own comments, Danieal Manning made it known change is in the air when he was asked about the departure of Ricky Manning Jr., the former nickel back. "Right now they are moving some stuff around,'' Danieal Manning said. ``They said they are going to try something different. Some stuff might change.'' You can read in to it different ways, but DM was asked about the nickel position, and indicated he was informed of changes the staff is looking to make. That could mean his backup, or any number of things, but I think there is a very legit reason to believe DM is not our primary nickel back.

To be honest, I don't think I have ever thought he was that good. As I recall, we believed McKie was a good receiving FB, but have we ever seen that? He's been w/ us 4 years, and in only one year did he have a number of catches to speak about (25), but even in that year, was he really impressive? He can make the catch, and that counts for something w/ our stone handed receivers of late, but he did nothing after the catch. Nearly every time I see him make a catch, he is dropped immediately. He doesn't have the cut or exceleration to turn it up the field. I'm not talking homerun, but for a few yards to turn a 3-5 yard pass/catch into a 6-10 yard gain. Does he even show power after the catch? And has he ever stood out as a blocker? In the run game or passing? This is an area I have wanted to upgrade for years, but it just doesn't happen. The FB is just below QB and OL on our priority list.

Bazuin needs to shine tonight or he will be IR'd or cut. I'd go with IR since he is yet to be fully recovered from his two surguries. Regardless, I don't see him on the active roster making Idonije the 4th DE which will good for short yardage situations given his bulk. I think he is cut. I don't think he would go along w/ the IR, as he may believe he has a better shot picking up w/ a team's active roster elsewhere. I think Toeina is gone. I disagree he is our best run stuffer. I think Adams is our most proven run stuffer. Also, Dusty is healthy now, and that is an area he excels, and we just drafted Harrison, who also is expected to be a solid run stuffer. Here is how i look at it. Wale, Brown and Anderson are locks at DE. Harris, Dusty, Harrison, Adams are locks at DT. Then there is Idonije, who has been one of our most impressive players in camp and preseason. Due to his versatility, he provides us both a 4th DE and a 5th DT. So he allows us to keep 8 DL, and thus one more roster spot at another position. Toeina could be moved to the PS. He doesn't have enough regular season games to hurt his eligibility, and I am not sure he has shown so much to the league to be stolen. Bazuin, and the rookie DE from the year, simply haven't shown enough to be kept.

No way I see us cutting Steltz. He has done nothing to earn his roster spot, but was a high enough pick, and one the staff said they envisioned as a starter. Further, he is our backup FS. I think the team is looking to groom him as Brown's replacement, and thus will be more patient w/ him this year. No way he would make it to our PS. Its one thing when you are talking about 7th round picks, but he was a higher graded prospect, and another team would be far more likely to pick him up if we made him available. DM may not have been "that bad" at nickel, but from his own mouth, he has been demoted and is no longer our nickel DB. So, he has failed at FS, CB and nickel. He was also talked about at SS for this year, but maybe due to what the staff saw in practice, never got too much of a look there. So at the end of the day, we have an athletic kid who simply doesn't have a position, and has failed to impress at any position the staff has tried him. Blame the staff if you choose, but does it matter? In the staff's eyes, he hasn't gotten it done at any position he has been tried at. If he were not a high pick, would he be on the team? IMHO, the players who have done little to nothing to warrant a roster spot are: DM, Steltz and Bowman. At the same time however, all are high enough draft picks that I have a hard time seeing the staff cut lose. I think you also factor (a) Brown is likely in his last year as a bear and ( we are totally unsettled at SS. Thus, I think we could keep all of our DBs discussed, and cut lose a DL or even LB. Final point. We use our DBs a lot of teams, as we prioritize speed and getting downfield over power. Thus, your 9th DB is more likely to see the field than your 9th DL.

But the kicker is DMs demotion, which was said by DM himself. W/ 24 hours of our releasing RMJ, DM tells the media he is being demoted. As I said before, if the staff liked what they say in DM, and felt he was going to be able to secure the nickel slot, it would make a bit more sense. I would be skeptical of DM, but at least understand the logic. But that isn't the case. They determined DM could not handle the nickel role, and yet still choose to release RMJ. Now we don't even know who our nickel will be, but the expectation is McGowan or Payne, neither of which I think are better than RMJ.

Agreed. PFT is a rumor mill, and as such, not held to the same standard as some like ESPN or Fox, yet at the same time, quite a lot of what you put out there does in fact come true. PFT may have once been a garbage site that was simply fun to read the rumors on, but they have really grown and developed. More and more players, coaches and even GMs have referenced their sites. Peter King and other established writers reference their site as well. Further, Florio now also works as a writer for Sportingnews and gets numerous appearances on various sports radio talk shows. Not everything they put out there proves true. They are a rumor mill. But I think they have gained a level of credibility few credit them for. Also, I give them credit for owning up to mistakes, which many fail to do.

Quarterbacks (2): The Bears almost always keep three, but they might go with just Kyle Orton and Rex Grossman and stash promising rookie Caleb Hanie on the practice squad, hoping no other team claims him for their active roster, which is probably a safe bet. I agree it is probably a safe bet, but I think the question should be asked, do we like him enough to warrant the risk? What is it they say about Vegas? Only gamble what you are willing to lose. I know we want the extra roster spot, but how upset would we (the staff) be if another team did take Hanie from us. I agree it isn't very likely, but it is a risk. At most positions, this would not be a great issue, but do we want to gamble on a young QB who has shown some potential. Running backs (5 or 6): Matt Forte, Kevin Jones, Adrian Peterson and Garrett Wolfe all appear to be roster locks. Jason McKie might be the only fullback who sticks. Odd men out: RB P.J. Pope and FB Lousaka Polite. Likely true, but unfortunate. I simply think very little of McKie. I don't think he is a very good run blocker, average pass blocker, and while he was always hyped as a good receiver, I have never seen much to impress. He catches the ball, but always seems to be tackles immediatly, not showing much YAC potential. I am not saying Polite is a stud, or close, but I wonder if he doesn't have more upside than McKie. Wide receivers (6): Devin Hester and Rashied Davis are the only locks, but it would be shocking if veterans Marty Booker and Brandon Lloyd don't stick, and rookie Earl Bennett is a third-round pick. Underachieving Mark Bradley still has upside, which probably buys him one more year to produce, but he's no lock. Odd men out: Mike Hass and Brandon Rideau have shown NFL skills in the past, but the numbers seem stacked against them, unless the Bears decide they can do without one of the veterans. One of the most interesting to watch. I would add Bennett as a lock. His play doesn't warrant that, but I can't see us cutting a 3rd round pick so soon. I think his draft status makes him a lock also. Lloyd has shown enough to stick. That's four. Booker has done little, but I personally think the staff has not played him much, believing they know what they have in him. I believe if they were less sure about him, we would have seen him more. Bradley has done little to warrant a roster spot, but if he is healthy, I don't see the staff cutting him, as he has that downfield potential the staff loves. So many assume we only keep 5, but I agree it is likely we keep 6. Tight ends (3): No tough decisions here, although Desmond Clark's knee injury could require an additional body besides Greg Olsen and rookie Kellen Davis. Odd men out: Fontel Mines and Marcus Stone. Not even sure we would keep an additional body. At best, we try to stash Mines in the PS in case, while Clark is still hurt, Olsen or Davis go down. But otherwise, I think we would be fine w/ two healthy TEs until Clark is 100%. Offensive line (8 or 9): Current starters LT John St. Clair, LG Josh Beekman, C Olin Kreutz, RG Roberto Garza and RT John Tait will be joined by first-round pick T Chris Williams, who is rehabbing after back surgery, and Terrence Metcalf, who was starting at LG before a knee scope. With Williams not expected back until after midseason, there's room for another rookie tackle, either seventh-round pick Kirk Barton or undrafted Cody Balogh. A backup guard spot should go to Tyler Reed or Anthony Oakley. Odd men out: G Ryan Poles. Seventh-round pick Chester Adams could wind up on the practice squad, and so could Barton and/or Balogh, as well as Reed and/or Oakley. Any of them could also be cut. After the first 7, I think we keep Barton. After that, it is between Reed and Oakley, and which ever has more diversity (can play OG or OT) or special teams could decide. Defensive line (9): Starters Tommie Harris, Anthony Adams or Dusty Dvoracek, Alex Brown and Adewale Ogunleye are sure things, along with Mark Anderson and Israel Idonije, who can play end or tackle, and third-round rookie Marcus Harrison. That probably leaves just one spot for injury-prone DE Dan Bazuin, last year's second-round pick; DT Matt Toeaina, who played well at the end of last season; and seventh-round pick Ervin Baldwin. Odd men out: Two of the last three, plus rookie DEs Joe Clermond and Nick Osborn. I would not be shocked at all to see us keep only 8. Idonije's play this year, and his versatility to play DT or DE gives us more opportunity. W/ Idonije, we essentially have a 4th DE and a 5th DT. I think Bazuin is gone. He simply has not done enough with his time, nor has Baldwin. Toeaina hurts to lose, as he did show something, but when you are as deep at a position as we are here, you often do end up cutting some queality. This is one of the few areas teams will actually be looking to see who we cut. Linebackers (6 or 7): Starters Lance Briggs, Brian Urlacher and Hunter Hillenmeyer are for sure along with top backup Jamar Williams. Darrell McClover and Nick Roach should make it on special-teams play alone. Odd men out: Michael Okwo, a third-round pick last year, is on thin ice, as is seventh-round rookie Joey LaRocque, unless the Bears keep seven. After Williams, I think Roach has done enough to make the team. After him, I think it is between McClover and Okwo. McClover has done more to earn the spot, but Okwo has the draft pick status. Should go to McClover, but will it? Defensive backs (9 or 10): CBs Charles Tillman, Nate Vasher and Corey Graham, CB-S Danieal Manning and safeties Mike Brown, Brandon McGowan, Kevin Payne and Craig Steltz are in. CBs Trumaine McBride and fifth-round pick Zackary Bowman aren't sure things, but at least one will make it and maybe both. McBride struggled in camp, but he played better than expected last season as a seventh-round pick. Odd men out: CB Trey Brown, S Leonard Peters. Gotta think we keep 9 here. McBride hasn't looked good this year, but showed enough last year to warrant the roster spot. Especially since we are having to keep two spots for a pair of rookies who have done little to earn a spot, but will get one due to draft status. Keeping the extra DB could be why we keep only 8 DL. Also would point out we use our DBs heavily on special teams, thus deep depth DBs have more weekly value than deep depth DL. Specialists (3): PK Robbie Gould, P Brad Maynard and LS Pat Mannelly About the most no-brainer unit in terms of figuring depth chart.

I will say this. I think the Trib used to be far better online than they are now. Particularly in camp, the Trib used to be the best. Their message board site also used to be upper tier. Then, as I recall, they drastically reduced their budget for online services (at least that was the explanation given). Now they are okay, but not anything great. I think the Sun Times is better, but elite? I would ask you this. When there is breaking news, is it our local papers that usually break the news, or do they simply repeat what others break?

I think the lack of warm and fuzzies was about his situation w/ the team. He said he would speak w/ the coaches, who will tell him he was part of the plans, and then he would not see the field. He talked about how undrafted rookies were getting action in practice, and he could only watch. He said it was frustrating because he simply was never allowed an opportunity to do anything. People can say what they will, but I really question this, particularly in combo w/ the demotion of DM. If DM was really stepping up, fine. But right now, we simply do not have a nickel. We have (once again) a group of young players we hope can step up, and we have cut a veteran who may not have been great, but was a far better safety net. This just screams of our letting Harris go last year.

When you see a string of 20 posts w/ crucker and I going back and forth, don't expect too much insight. More likely, we are just bored and avoiding work.

Agreed on McBride. The kid looked dang good last year, and I doubt even the coaches expected that. He hasn't look good this year, but (a) last years performance should buy him a bit of time and ( he was a late round pick who is only entering his 2nd season. gotta give these kids time to develop. Regarding RMJ, has he done anything since joining the bears? Maybe I am missing something, but even the computer incident, didn't that happen before he signed w/ us? Right before, but before? Point is, either way, he hasn't really done anything I can think of (other than that one incident) that questions his character. He has been a pretty good character guy for the bears.