nfoligno

Defense: CBs: ....grade C+. C- tops for me. We are ranked 22nd in the league in pass defense. We have just 3 interceptions as a team, and only one by a DB. Now, a lot of the yardage issues may be a result of scheme, but I would also say we have seen some really shoddy tackling by our DBs. In our scheme, one of the biggest keys for the DBs is tackling. Its the difference between stoping a WR after a 4-7 yard gain and giving up a big play. The iffy tackling, high yardage and lack of turnovers has to cause a below average grade. S: ...grade C+. C. While we have not seen the big breakdowns we have seen in the past, I really just have not seen the big plays either. DM and Afalava have gotten in on blitzes a couple times, but part of the secondary pass defense issues has to also go on the safeties. They have been average, and have avoided giving up big plays, but I would not say they have been above average. LB: I"ll give them a B+. I'd agree w/ this. I might even go higher if we allow to factor 2 starters down w/ injuries, as well as our primary backup MLB. I am still not a huge Roach fan, but he has made some solid plays. Briggs has really stepped up in Urlacher's absence, and Jamar Williams made a couple plays too. Middle is still a bit weak, but getting stonger. DT: Grade C-. I'd go D-. This has been maybe the biggest disappointment for me on defense. You say Harris has started to step up the last couple games, but I just haven't seen it. Yea, he got the interception, but do you realize the reason he got that pick? Because he got stood up at the LOS and was no where near the QB. He gets credit for the catch, but lets be honest, he was in position to make the catch because he did not get any penetration on the play. As I see it, our DEs have done a pretty solid job (outstanding at times) of pressuring the passer, but our DTs have been so ineffective that QBs too easily just step up in the pocket to avoid the DEs. Adams has done well in run defense, but I just see Harris getting pushed around too much, and lacking any burst. Harrison has been more invisible than Casper. Heck, maybe the best DT play I have seen came from Anderson who lined up inside some yesterday. DE: Grade A. Agreed. As said above, I think our DEs are playing very well. IMHO, if we got any penetration, or even a better push from the DTs, the DEs numbers would be even better. As it stands though, 2.5 sacks and 5 TFL from Brown. 4.5 sacks and 1 TFL from Wale. Only 1 sack (2 TFL) from Anderson, but I have seen him in the backfield a lot more disrupting plays. If we could get better play from our DTs, our DL would be scary good. Defensive coaching: Grade B-. Grade C. While I give Lovie credit for adjustments and Marinelli credit for our DEs in particular playing on a higher level, I just can't go this high for coaching. A backup QB and rookie QB just lit us up through the air. We are allowing offenses to move the ball early in games far too easily. Credit the adjustments, but our defense simply does not look ready to play when the whistle blows. It seems like opponents are game planning better than we, but we are doing a better job adjusting. It has not shot us dead yet, but when we have to face a really good offense, will adjustments be enough? We just can not continue to start games so flat. OFFENSE: WR: Grade B. Grade here sort of depends on whether you factor expectations. If you factor expectations, I would have to give an A grade. Three leading receivers on the team are WRs, and I don't think anyone would have expected that entering the season. Each also has a solid ypc average. We are getting solid play from a WR that have zero catches entering this season and very good play from a 5th round rookie WR. If I don't factor expectations, I would likely then go w/ a B grade. WR play has been solid, and at times special, but not so much that defenses are playing a massive amount of nickel against us as you would see w/ many other uppier tier passing offenses. RB: C. I would go w/ a C-. While the run game stepped up big in the last game, that is one our of 3. We currently rank 22nd in run offense, w/ a below 4 ypc average. Further, I think our blitz pickup by the RBs has been very questionable as well. This last game may have given reason for hope, but if we are grading this unit based on the first 4 games, I don't think I could say they have been average. Oline: Grade D. I'll go w/ a F here. Sorry, but this OL has simply been awful. IMHO, the pass protection has not improved so much as the QB has simply played better and made the OL look better. Cutler is not holding the ball long, and getting rid of it w/ 3 and 5 step drops, which makes the OL look better, even if it is not. Simply put, our OL is limiting our passing game. Further, our OL has been flat out awful in run blocking, which is best seen in short yardage downs. That is when we really need to get a forward push, but they are simply driven backward. TE: Overall grade B+. I'd give them a B. It has been solid, and Davis has stepped up w/ some solid plays, but Olsen was supposed to be a star, and has not stepped up w/ too many dropped passes. Blocking has been questionable from this group as well. QB: Grade B+. I'd go w/ an A here. Awful 1st game, but followed up w/ consecutative game winning drives and, while not big yardage in the last game, he was very effective regardless. Cutler has a near 90 rating through 4 games. He has just over a 64 completion percentage. He has 8 TDs passing. And I just have to factor what he is working w/. Most would agree our OL sucks, and yet he still is ranked among the QB leaders, and I think most would agree he has been tremendous for our very green WR corps. Offensive coaching: I'll give Turner a B. This will make Jason nuts, but I'll give him a B+. Our offense is not only moving the ball, but putting points on the board. We are a top 10 scoring offense w/ 26.3 ppg. We are doing that despite no help from the OL and a run game that only decided to show up in game 4. Yes, there has been plenty of head scratching plays, but at the end of the day, our offense is looking very good, and doing so w/o a ton of elite talent or solid OL play. Special Teams: Gotta give Toub an A. I'll go B+. Until this last game, coverage units have been weaker than usual. Hester had been fairly weak in punt returns. Maynard and Gould have been awesome, and Knox was great, but this unit simply has not been as great or consistent as in years past. Head coach. Overall grade B. I'll go w/ a B too. I do not think we are doing a good job of preparing players or getting them ready for games, but overall, as a HC, he is doing well.

Think about it as a best case life lesson. Often to truly learn a lesson, you have to first make a mistake. Knox made a mistake, but as it was not caught on game day, there were no negative consequences for the team. However, at least one coach saw it when it happened, and let Knox have it. Further, you can bet Knox will hear a lot more about it in film sessions and could get some punishment/hazing for it in practice too. Point is, he screwed up, and he will individually pay for it, but the team did not suffer as the refs didn't see it.

For sure Toub deserves a lot of credit. It doesn't seem to matter who returns kicks or punts, we get good yards off the returns. Naturally some of that is talent but blocking and scheme is just as big a part of it. Coverage units have played well too and get better each week. It really is incredible when you think about it. Hester was all-world in both punt and kickoff returns. I remember when the staff pulled him from kickoff returns and inserted DM, and fans went nuts. Then DM looked incredible. Then DM is pulled due to starting and Knox is inserted, and again, many fans went nuts, but he quickly looked great too. On punt returns, Hester goes down and Bennett steps in and steps up. While you have to give credit to the individual returners, you just do not replace players like this w/o giving huge credit to the coaching. I'd like to give props to Turner for scaling back what he asked Knox to learn to start off the year. Last year they forced Bennett to digest the entire playbook and it delayed his progress. Making an adjustment from that shows an ability to hold himself accountable for decisions that don't work out. Not everyone can put their ego (and their "system") aside to do that. There were many on the board that didn't think Knox would make the final roster and would end up on the practice squad. Agreed. Turner gets tons of crap, and deservedly so, for how he handled Bennett, but also deserved credit for admitting a wrong and fixing it. While I thought fans were nuts who didn't feel Knox would make the team, at the same time, I felt he was a player who would need more time to develop as I felt he was more of a raw talent. Not only do I give Turner credit for limiting Knox in what we initially threw at him, but also, I think we have avoided putting too much on the rookie after he started to make plays. Many here on this board talked about moving him into the starting lineup, but the staff thus far has basically kept him in the slot, which is IMHO, best for the kid and the team, at least for now.

I am flat out thrilled we have been capable of making adjustments, and love that our coaches have been able to inspire players at halftime. But that does not negate the problem this team is having to start games, and that is becoming a concern. A rookie QB drove the ball down our throats on the opening drive, and didn't stop there. Look, its great to make adjustments, but against good teams, that may be too little too late.

2nd, in defense of Turner. Unless you work for an NFL franchise as a coach, you don't know more about delivering "High quality H2O" than this guy, let alone being an OC. Am I saying shut up and don't criticize him? Hell no. But don't act like he's an idiot and you know more. It just takes from individual credibilty. Before Jason even has an opportunity, this is an argument I have never cared for. You say you are not telling fans to shut up and not criticize, but at the same time, you essentially are, and further saying anyone who does not "takes from their individual credibility". By the rationale, we can never question player or coach. I just find that laughable. Wanny was an NFL coach. You never questioned his decision making? Jauron? Shoop? Come on. Everyone here has questioned moves/calls by our staff, GM, etc., yet by your argument, we are thus only taking away from our own individual credibility. Further, I was watching the game and saw us line up Forte in the backfield on 3rd and 1, and said it was a mistake. I come on to this board later and said the same. According to you, I have not qualified to question the playcall of Turner, as he is a NFL coach and I am not. And yet, later Turner said it was a mistake. Thus, even though I am not a NFL coach, I was capable of seeing a play as a mistake. No, I do not believe I could ever be an OC. Its kind of like the GM. Could I do decent in the 1st round of the draft. I think I could. But in the later rounds, could I do well? Far more questionable. Could I also manage the cap and build the entire team. Not very likely. Same w/ OC. Could I call a play here and there successfully. Yes, I think I could. Could I playcall an entire game. Hell no. But that doesn't mean I am so uninformed that I can't question particular playcalls. Lastly, while I hate seeing Wolfe getting stuffed, I do understand the concept. If Wolfe breaks just one run from the inside, it changes the gameplan forever when he comes in the game. (the whole playbook is opened for hom now and he becomes a true weapon) It's kinda like using Hester on the WR screen and reverses last year. They never worked. Now they do. While I am not disagreeing w/ your Wolfe point in general, I am not sure I go along w/ your example. IMHO, Hester not doing well on screens last year compared to this year is more about the QB than hester. Cutler delivers the ball quickly, while Orton did not, and that makes a huge difference.

If I may use your analogy... How many other students math exams have you studied? While I am sure you have glanced at some, I doubt you examine any of their exams to the same degree. Does Turner make some questionable, or even boneheaded calls? Sure. But when you say other OC's may make mistakes but not as many or on such a scale, I would argue that is only your perception because you watch Turner far more than the rest, and do so w/ a far more critcial eye. I hate to continue to go back to it, but the Jason Garrett example I gave just seems like such a great example. Here is an OC who was the golden boy of not only Dallas, but the league as he was supposedly turning down HC offers on the belief he would very soon be the HC in Dallas. Throwing it twice from the one yard line when your run game was AVERAGING 8 yards per cary is worse than even the Wolfe example. I bet you if you were to ask a Phily fan, NE fan, Baltimore fan, whatever you want, you would find out their fans could give you just as many examples of boneheaded playcalls by their coaches. Thats just the way it goes.

I agree. I think everyone agrees, including Turner, 3rd and 1 is not a good play to have Wolfe in there. As much as the problem is OL, I also think Forte simply is not running well. To me, he currently seems to lack speed, quickness, power and vision. Basically everything that made him great last year. Whether the reason is injury, confidence, whatever, I think we need to be playing a lot more of AP, and I am not even a fan of AP like some. Hell, I wanted to cut him. But at the moment, I think AP is probably our best runner, and I would absolutely use him on 3rd and 1. Also, something else I noticed, on that 3rd and 1 play, Wolfe was set damn near 10 yards into the backfield. I could not believe how far back he was. Now, I am not sure if that is something we do w/ Wolfe, that we would not have done w/ AP or Forte, but Wolfe lining up so deep w/o question (in my mind at least) factored into that play being a bust. On 3rd and 1, you need plays that are quick. For example, you would not use a delayed handoff on 3rd and 1. The defense is coming, and all a delayed handoff does is give the defense more time to get into the backfield. While our play on that 3rd down may not have been a delayed handoff, the distance Wolfe had to run before getting the ball had the same effect.

IMHO, he and Benson were actually very similar. Both were talented, and even in similar style, but both were sort of jerks (misunderstood if you ask them) and thus fans always trashed them.

Actually, I don't remember his beating up a teamate. Regardless, I said he was not liked, and yea, he was a dill rod. We have had our fair share of idiot RBs here. But that was sort of the point. Because he was not liked, injury was not seen as an "excuse". I would point to Marc Columbo. Most call him an injury related bust, rather than simply referring to him just as a bust. He was not a disliked person, thus fans are more allowing of the injury excuse. Enis is usually simply referred to as a total bust, even though he has a greater injury excuse than most.

Agreed. Funny how times make people forget. People say Lovie holds rookies back, but few coaches held back rookies like Wanny, who gave James Allen the nod of Enis. Just as Enis proved himself and was given the start, and looked pretty darn good in that game, he blows out his knee. Fans also forget that he returned to the game and played (I think) the rest of the game w/ a knee that was essentially destroyed. He played another season or so after that, but was never healthy. I remember reading that, later, he essentially had to get a new knee. No clue what the means, but the opinion was his knee was totally destroyed. Like Benson, Enis didn't do much to make fans love him, and thus when he didn't live up to the hype, fans didn't want to hear the excuses, but the reality is, Enis' career was destroyed by injury. Fans don't want to allow for that excuse because, well, fans don't like him. But that is the truth.

Yea, especially w/ Jones out, we need to use Wolfe more than just as a scat back. If he can't run inside, then we know what we have in him, but we need to try him at all areas to see what we have. Wolfe not only gained 6 on that prior inside run, but looked very good in doing so. Frankly, it was sort of comical how he "hid" behind the big OL. I swear he gained the yards because the defenders couldn't find him. 3rd and 1 is not a situation Wolfe should be in there, but... (a) what has not been talked about is, no matter what RB we had back there, the play was dead. The defense blew up our line on the play, and Wolfe was hit well in the backfield. If Cutler handed off to Brandon Jacobs, he would have been stuffed. It isn't like Wolfe hit the LOS and was stopped because he wasn't strong enough to drive forward for the 1st. He was hit probably 3 or 4 yards behind the LOS. It just wouldn't matter of Wolfe or Forte or AP were in there. We would have been stuffed regardless. ( just curious, but for all the posters who say we should have had a power runner in there, should we have given McKie the ball. You know, that popular quick FB handoff? Yea, that play is real popular around here To me, it comes down to this. Should Wolfe have been on the field on 3rd and 1? No. Would it have made a difference if we had another RB in there? No. W/ the play of our OL right now, 3rd and 1 is a passing down.

While I am not saying I agree w/ the top 5 aspect, how much do you think others factor talent. We as fans often think more highly of our own talent than most around the league. But since Turner showed up.... How often have we had a QB the league would considered good? Remember, it all starts w/ the QB. Hard to look great on offense when you are going through 3 QBs (all of which suck) per season. How often have we had an OL that would be considered average, much less good? Last time I recall our having an OL that was worth a damn, we went to the SB. How often have we had a WR that was worth jack? Yes, I realize your opinion that our WRs are better than they have shown, but (a) w/o a QB that talent just didn't have the path to emerge and ( we are talking about the perception of a coach, and thus perception is key. If the perception is we have not had any legit WRs, then when talking about the perception of the coach, it becomes reality. While we have had our share of talent at RB, consistency is a big issue. We had TJ, then TJ and Benson, then Benson, then Forte. One thing I have always heard is, it is difficult for a coach to develop a good looking unit when turnover is high. When every season you have a different RB, or RBs have different roles, it makes things difficult. Am I saying he is top 5? No. But I do think you have to consider the talent we have provided our offense through the years. You said yourself Turner is looking a lot better this year. Well, he finally has a QB to utilize. Remember, it all starts w/ the QB. Look around the league. Most of the teams that suck today lack a QB. Look at a team like Carolina, who prior to this year, was thought to have a good OC, but now that Delhomme sucks, their offense and offensive coach are in question.

Wait a minute. Can you name one poster on this board who thinks Turner is "infalible?" Heck, is there a poster on this board who would even go so far as to say Turner is a "great" OC? I don't think so. If the question was posed, is Turner a top 16 OC, you might find some takers, but frankly, that isn't saying "that" much. I don't think anyone here considered Turner close to the level you talk about. I think it is more a matter of defending a coach who some consider the worst OC in the NFL, or darn close to it. My point is, just because he makes some bad calls, that doesn't make him a bad OC. My point is every OC in the game makes questionable calls, some of which make Turner's bad calls look a lot better. See my Jason "Golden Boy" Garrett story. As for the final part, when you say, "some on this board" I think you and I both know you are talking about one individual, and I get it. Yes, at times I too feel there is a belief that if you are employed in the NFL you are smarter than anyone else. While that is often true, it simply is not always the case. Like w/ the Wolfe play, you, I and many screamed this was bad before the snap. Turner admitted as much later. Thus, even the "expert" made a mistake we novices would not have made. So yes, you and I agree on in that sense. But in general, I do think you tend to trash Turner for each and every little thing. Does he make bad calls. Hell yes. But so does every freaking OC in the game. I mentioned this in another thread, but IMHO, Turner did a pretty solid job last year, particularly when you consider what he had to work with. This year, I think he has done a pretty damn good job. Then I start to think about something. Last year, while he did not have a great QB, he had one that was more managable than Rex was. Further, rather than Benson, he had Forte. I am starting to think that, a big part of Turner's early year crap coaching may have a lot more to simply due w/ players and personnel. A coach can only do so much if he doesn't have the players, and the players do not execute. Over the last two seasons, we have had more talent and consistent players on offense, and suddenly Turner doesn't look like such a bad OC. Maybe he was never as bad as we made him out to be, but the talent was worse.

LOL

First, my point was that numerous posters complain not just about Wolfe running up the middle on 3rd and 1, but ever running up the middle. That was part of my argument. If Wolfe is ever to be more than a 3rd down back, he needs to prove he is capable of running inside as well as out. Second, just to throw something out there. 3rd and 1 is an obvious up the gut run, right? If you are the defense though, and you see the diminuitive Wolfe in the backfield, might you not think the play is going to be something else. I am not for this play, but I can see how it could be argued that w/ Wolfe in there, a run up the middle is less expected than if we put AP in there. Third, something that really has not been factored here is, no matter what RB we had back there, that play was dead. This really has not been talked about, but Seattle had a defender in the backfield by the time Wolfe took the handoff. I don't care if the handoff was to Forte, AP or Wolfe. That play was dead as soon as it started, and before you blast Turner for that, watch the replay and take a look at the OL. Wolfe being in there on 3rd and 1 is not great, but what just is not getting talked about here is, how much did it matter. Forte has been running w/ cement in his feet. The OL has either been pushed backward or simply allowed penetration. Right now, it doesn't matter what RB we have in the backfield. Frankly, IMHO, 3rd and 1 is a passing down for us at the moment.

One, specifically on Wolfe, while I disagreed w/ (and he admitted it was a mistake) the 3rd and 1 call, prior to that Wolfe ran outside for 3 and up the gut for 6. According to you, he should have never had that 6 yard gain. If all we ever do is run Wolfe to the outside, then we are predictable, which is something I think you have ripped Turner for. Two, I simply think that no matter the OC, fans are going to find plays to question. Did you watch the Cowgirls v Carolina Monday night game? In that game, Dallas was running at will on Carolina. They have a HUGE size advantage in the trench w/ one of the biggest OLs in the league, and had an freakish 8 ypc run average. They had the ball at the 1 yard line on 2nd down. Jason Garrett, their golden boy OC, calls for a pass play, which everyone questioned, but okay, they took a shot. But on 3rd and goal, they again went to the air, and again, no good. They settled for a FG. Just think about that one for a moment. Carolina has shown no ability to stop the run, and yet on two plays at the one yard line, you don't even try to run it in. By kicking the FG, Dallas only went ahead by 6 and kept Carolina in the game. Point of that story is, no matter what coach or team, you will find playcalls that just baffle fans, announcers and everyone else watching. IMHO, Turner has mixed it up a lot more this year, and I credit him for that. I still believe this year's issues are far more about execution than playcalling. That is not to say playcalling is perfect, but simply that is has not been the problem some say. Third, I actually give Turner credit for the job he did last year. Entering the season, we had an OL that stunk, a QB who at best was considered a game manager, a rookie RB and a group of flat out weak WRs. Yet our offense was not bad, and ranked 14th in the league in terms of scoring. And different from previous seasons, he did that w/o help from the defense, which was pretty pathetic. I used to rip Turner as well, but I began to give him credit for last year, and further, more and more, I have begun to really wonder how much of the past issues were turner, as opposed to what he had to work with.

Why are we eating crow? Because there are some plays, or some aspects, of our offensive playcalling that we question. I really would love to meet this perfect offensive coordinator you compare everyone to. He must be a great guy. He isn't employed in the NFL, but must be great regardless. EVERY OC in the league makes questionable calls. Everyone of them. On the play prior to the questionable 3rd down call, Wolfe went up the middle and gained 6 yards. Now, that is not to say he should have been called on to do the same on 3rd and 1, but was it wrong to call for Wolfe to go up the middle. Prior to that, he went off tackle for a 3 yard gain as well, which may not sound like much, but is more than Forte got on most of his runs for the day. I thought you were one who felt Wolfe was more than just a 3rd down back. I thought you felt Wolfe could really carry the load. Well, that means more than just screens and sweeps. He needs to also show he can run it up the gut. Again, that doesn't mean on 3rd and short. Point is, that is one play. I personally am not in favor of how we are rotating series, but is that enough to eat crow? I don't think so. Our offense is looking pretty good right now, and doing so w/ near no help from the OL. A RB really struggling. A great QB, but new to the team and system, which often results in inconsistent play. WRs who, while talented, are really lacking in experience and learning on the fly. This was an offense I felt would get better as the season went along, but is gelling far sooner than most would have expected. Is Turner perfect. God no! I am not sure how good/great he is either. I do think he is doing a pretty solid job, and felt that way last year too. Last year, we lacked at most every unit, and yet our offense did fairly well. I guess my ultimate point to you would be this. Like w/ the WR position, it is really hard to evaluate an offensive coordinator when you don't have a QB. You know the lipstick and pig saying. We now have a QB, and I think can really evaluate Turner. So far, there have been some questionable calls, which again, I would argue every coach makes, but on the whole, I think he has called a pretty good game. IMHO, players and execution are holding us back at the moment rather than coaching.

I really do not like this RB rotation we have going. I understand we want to spell Forte, but I just do not understand the all or nothing approach. Why do we have to sit Forte for an entire series? Or why do we have to play Wolfe for an entire series. Why can we not just rotate our backs. If Forte sits, and Wolfe or AP come in, but we get near the goal line, I would rather see Forte return. Just like if Wolfe breaks off a good run, but we are in 3rd and 1, we need to change our RB. You see teams all the time rotate their backs. I just don't understand why we have this mentality that one back must play an entire series, rather than rotate what back plays based on down and distance and such. When we had that 3rd and 1, w/ Wolfe in there, I thought for sure McKie was going to take the handoff.

Agreed on your keepers and add Anderson, Harrison and Adams. IMO - Adams has forced the staff to like him. Adams - I have always liked him, but I just question how much the staff does. If Dusty didn't go down w/ injury, and Harrison didn't show up to camp out of shape, would Adams even be starting? Even if the staff has come to appreciate him more, how much will be tested before the 2 year period I mentioned as we will have to re-sign him. I am just not confident the staff will want to re-sign him. They simply do not care for DTs that can't rush the passer. Harrison may well still be around, but I see that as far from a lock. He showed "something" on a few occasions last year, but didn't exactly break out. This year, he showed up to camp over weight and out of shape, and his work ethic came into question, prompting the staff to sit him until he got his weight down. Thus far, through only three games I realize, he has shown nothing. There is still time, but I just am not so confident he sticks long term. Anderson - He is a FA after this season, and (a) needs to show a lot for us to even think about re-signing him and ( even if he does show something, he could then position himself for a nice paycheck. Will we pay him? Briggs, Williams, Pisa and Roach should be here. Url may also have a couple years left, but I see a need to draft a replacement this year. Briggs w/o question. The rest? Williams is a FA after this season, and I frankly would be surprised if he re-signed. He has been stuck behind Briggs, and not until this season did we even give him an opportunity, short as it was, at a position other than WLB. Even now, w/ the injuries to Urlacher and Pisa, Williams seems like an after thought. I can easily see him looking to move on to a team where he may believe he has a better chance to play. Pisa - Could very well happen, but lets be honest for a moment. As great as he looked in camp, he has yet to do jack in the regular season. Before we declare him a long term starter, he needs to start a regular season game. Raoch - He may well be here, but I simply am not a big fan. Tillman to FS anyone? I like Graham and Bowman as starters and Manning as nickel. Jury is still out on Moore. Tillman to FS has always been a message board topic, and fans seem to love the idea, but the staff has never gone for it. - I am a big fan of Graham, but is the staff? Even when both Tillman and Bowman were hurt in preseason, the staff went w/ McBride, who was cut, over Graham. Graham is a mystery to me. He did pretty darn well last year, but the entire offseason, the staff simply has not seemed inclined to get him on the field. When Bowman was knocked out of the game for a short bit, it was Vasher who came in. That is the same Vasher who has stunk, and who has little future w/ the team. If Graham is in the plans at all, you sure could have fooled me. Afalava is a keeper. I also see a place for Payne and DM. Although I do not like DM's instincts as a starter. I do love his athleticism. I guess we keep drafting until get it right. (or see Tillman comment) I just don't see the place for Payne. I see this as a normal, "Circle of Life" type situation. You always see turnover. But as I look at the roster, I see far more than just some turnover. I see a total overhaul. Often you see a couple players per unit change over the period of a couple years, but I see the opposite. I see only a couple remaining over the next two years, and if that is the case, it would be an overhaul, not a tweak.

I question how much credit Hiestand gets for Beekman. Remember, the coaches flat said he was too small to play OG, and the ONLY reason he was looked in the first place was due to the injuries we suffered last year. If not for those injuries, he would have never seen the field. I agree we have not given him a ton to work w/, at the same time, even when we bring in veterans, it is on him to work w/ the OL. The reality is, our OL continues to suck, and I just can't see how he doesn't take more blame.

Hey, it isn't that I want an overhaul on defense necessarily, but when I look at our players on defense, I just see few players who will be on the team in two years time. You always have turnover, but I see VERY FEW players here today that will be in just two seasons. DL - Other than maybe Brown (who will be 32 in 2 years) and Gilbert, who do you see as a keeper. Wale and Anderson are FAs after this year. Harris looks done now. Staff never seemed to like Adams. LB - Briggs obviously. Pisa has yet to play, and as much as I like him, a lot to prove. Williams will be a FA and Hunter should be gone. CB - Tillman just doesn't look that good anymore and Bowman is just so injury prone. Staff doesn't seem to care much for Graham, which I just don't get. Moore has not shown jack. Vasher is w/o question gone. S - Afalava looks like a keeper. DM maybe. Payne and Steltz are likely gone. 2 years is just not that long, but in 2 years, I just don't see many players on the roster today still playing then.

Sort of like Pisa, I think it is more about adding a LB who knows your system and who is a good fit. Trotter can slide into the Phily system w/o an issue of learning curve. I am not sure he would have been as ideal of a pickup for us. IMHO, Philly adding Trotter would be more like our adding Brooks. Right now, I think our staff is unlikely to make an addition as Pisa is about ready to return and, while I am not as much of a fan, the staff seems to like Roach.

First, I am not sure the playing weight is that different among our LBs. Pisa is 230lbs. I realize there were articles about how he dropped weight as the season went on but (a) that is true of EVERY player and ( Rusty was supposed to be working w/ him to better maintain his playing weight. Roach is 234lbs, only 4 lbs heavier than Pisa. Williams is 237 and Hunter 238. From what we are hearing, it sounds like Roach will be the man once Pisa returns, so I just question how big of an issue the weight is. For the record, this really puts what sort of player Urlacher was into perspective. Urlacher's listed weight is 258, which is closer to our DE size than LB, and yet he had such speed and athleticism that players 20 and 30 pounds lighter can't match. That is simply freakish. Second, if you don't think about weight for a moment, and just go off what you have seen on the field. Did you get to watch that 2nd preseason game against NYG? There was a play that made ESPN where Brandon Jacobs flat out ran over Urlacher. W/ in a play or two after that, Jacobs again had the ball, but this time Pisa was the first on the scene, and he stood up Jacobs. Urlacher then came in and cleaned up. That is just one play, but IMHO, was reflective of what we saw Pisa do when he was on the field. He simply doesn't seem to play to his weight. I am not saying we should move Pisa to the middle. Honestly, I do not know how much he has played there, and how well it would work. I just don't know. But I do not think his size should be the reason to don't do it. Pisa has shown he can tackle as well or better than any of our LBs, except maybe Briggs. There is little question the MLB is a key in our defense, far more than SLB. If Pisa is our 2nd best LB, and can make the transition, then it very well may be something we need to look at. W/ the bye coming up, it would be a good time to work on any changes we do need to make.

I have to be honest. I look at our defense, and I wonder how many of these players will be here in the next couple years. DL - Wale and Anderson are due to be UFAs after this season. Adams is solid, but not one our staff seems to care for. Harrison came w/ promise, but has yet to really show that much and his work ethic has been very much put into question. Harris is looking more and more like a joke. That leaves Brown. I hate to say it, but I can see a tremendous amount of turnover in the next couple seasons on our DL. LB - Briggs is going no where. I would like to think Pisa is sticking for a while. Urlacher? No idea. Williams I think is a FA, and could look to move on for a team where he has a chance to play. Hunter may have worked his way out the door. While I am no fan, seems like Roach is doing something now. I think we will have some change here, and think our future starting MLB is not on the team. S - Payne sucks. Sorry, but he does. He may be decent in the box, but he sucks in coverage. Afalava looks like a keeper. Whether DM is our long term answer at FS, I have no clue. Steltz may not even stick as depth. CB - Vasher is likely gone after this season, if not before. Tillman, Bowman, Graham and Moore may all be around a couple years from now, but honestly, I am not impressed by this group. Tillman is a shell of his former self. Yea, he can create a turnover, but he was directly responsible for that TD after the blown tackle, and what does it say when Rothlisberger spends the day picking on Tillman rather than Bowman. Bowman can't stay healthy. Graham is one I like, but the coaches doesn't seem to share my opinion. Moore was a rookie I heard so much about, but did nothing in camp and is burried down the depth chart. I'll be honest. Right now, this defense looks in need of a major overhaul. I don't see that many pieces to build around anymore. On offense, we need to build up the OL, but otherwise, we have pretty good looking, young, talent. On defense though, most of our talent is older, and the younger players simply have not shown enough to give that much hope.

Yea, like last year when we needed a late 4th quarter drive for a TD to win 23-27.