Bears4Ever_34

Thank you for the vid. This just speaks to the inevitable. Martz will be gone after this season.

The Vikings do have Jared Allen, who is one of the best pass rushers in this league but their team still sucks and they are always playing from behind, and are ranked near the bottom of the league in pass defense (25th to be exact). On top of that, they play sort of the same vanilla defense we do and if there is one thing this offensive line can atleast contain somewhat, it's teams that don't throw exotic blitz packages against them. I'd be much happier if we played this way against the New Orlean Saints, or the Green Bay Packers and the top tier teams in the league and not some of the worst.

Question for anyone that noticed, I only caught a part of it on radio but Waddle and Silvy were talking about the cameras on Sunday night catching Cutler muttering some choice words possibly about Martz (They were trying to lip read and thought he said something like "Tell Mike to F off". Did anyone else catch this? Supposedly Collinsworth was talking over it while it was happening on the sidelines so you had to be a good lip reader to catch it. I was flipping back and forth between the Bears and Cardinals game so I missed it.

I'm not, but go ahead and try to twist the facts in your favor. Actually, you can because as I mentioned before, Kitna threw the ball 596 times in 2006, which was 2nd in the league behind only Brett Favre. More passes leads to more receptions to receivers. Mike Furrey was the slot receiver in 06 and 07 and excelled in the Mike Martz offense because Kitna was a quarterback who used the middle of the field quite a bit. Generally the slot receiver is usually the easiest pass to make because they do most of their work between the numbers. Well you are right in that sense. Kitna was surprisingly very good in the Martz scheme (And in alot of ways, is better than Cutler at it, given their skill sets). But the fact of the matter is, Kitna still had a #1 to work with and the Bears don't. Roy caught 82 balls for over 1300 yards in 06. The Bears haven't had a guy like that in forever and it's an absolute necessity for every team (No matter that scheme) to have a legit #1 target to throw to so teams have something other than Matt Forte to focus on. No, Kitna was able to spread the ball around even more in 2007 because of Calvin Johnson and the extra talent showed in the record (06 = 3 wins, 07 = 7 wins). Also I think it's worth mentioning that both Sean McDonald and Az Hakiim were both brought over to Detroit with Martz because they played in his system with the Rams while he was the Head Coach. So when they came in, they already knew the offense which only helps a quarterback even more when he has to trust guys to be in their spots. It may be hard to swallow but I don't think its that far fetched to say Detroits weapons aside from Roy and Calvin, are still better than the Bears receivers with the exception of maybe Knox. But only because of his speed. They were good before they got to the Lions. They didn't fit in Martz's scheme and it showed in the sack totals. I think even one year they were without Damien Woody for nearly an entire season and still put up points. Bottom Line: The point I'm trying to make is that you can still put up points in an offense without elite level talent on the offensive line if you have the elite talent at WR. It certainly is not ideal to have an offense without a good offensive line, but there has been instances where you can still get along without one and still be somewhat productive. Detroit was just an example I used because it dealt with Mike Martz. This all goes back to why I feel like the Bears should target a #1 receiver in round 1 of the draft next year as opposed to offensive line. I think I've made it clear on why I think that, by now but it's also because the best LT in the draft will likely be gone by the time we are drafting and we are going into a draft that isn't particularly filled with as much offensive line talent as there has been in recent years. If there was ever a year for us to find a #1 receiver, it's in this draft. WR is by far the strongest position next year.

Are you really using the Minnesota Vikings as your argument? Really?... Really?? Since when has measuring yourself against the worst become the customary thing when judging your team? I was under the impression that you find out who you really are by playing against the best. I take away nothing from this game, good or bad because we just played a team that's probably going to be drafting in the top 3 when it's all said and done.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, Chris.

I think what your saying is a moot point because we all know Mike Martz isn't going to be here after this year anyways and the Bears can go back to running a more conventional style of offense. Yes, the 7 step drops don't work here but Jerry Rice was a pretty good short yardage, middle yardage, any yardage kind of a receiver. That guy was pretty good wherever you threw him the ball. Wrong. Mike Furrey and Mcdonald were the beneficiaries of Roy Williams and Calvin Johnson being on the field and the fact that the only thing Detroit ever did was throw the ball, because their running game was so pathetic (More passes = more receptions). 2007 was also the year Roy Williams missed 4 games because of injuries. It's not uncommon for slot receivers to lead the team in receptions, but to use that as your argument is absolutely ridiculous. Um, what? Nobody ever said anything about posting the same stats. The way you and the other guy were talking sounded like Jerry Rice would have suddenly transformed into the next David Terrell. And I'm telling you he would still be GREAT. Lol. Just because some guy was drafted in the 1st round doesn't mean he was a stud on the Lions. If you didn't noticed, the Lions actually gave up more sacks in 2006 (63) than the Bears did last season. And the season after that, they gave up 51. So no, I wouldn't say I ignored anything. If by time, you mean no time-- then I would agree. It's just that, when on rare occasions the line did protect him, he was able to make plays because his receivers knew how to get open. Ours don't, and can't because they are not any good. I don't know how I can paint the picture any more clearly.

We don't have to. It's not a prerequisite. Time is only useful if receivers get open. Go back and watch the film from the last two seasons and take a look at how many coverage sacks Jay has taken because of the garbage receivers he has to work with. The Mike Martz coached offense back in Detroit was still fairly successful despite their poor offensive line play. Why is that? Because he could throw the ball to Calvin Johnson and a younger, better version of Roy Williams. And that was a team with virtually no balance what so ever because Kevin Smith was their running back.

I have a hard time believing the greatest WR to play the game would "Never amount to what he should have" if he played with this team. Besides, you're assuming he plays his entire career with this exact same cast of offensive lineman. People have become blinded by how poorly our offensive line has played that they don't realize that our receivers are damn near equally as bad. When Jay's leader in targets is Dane Sanzenbacher, you know you have a bad team. For all the Mike Martz talk about Roy Williams catching 70-80 passes.. Well he's about 72 short. Any elite receiver on this team, makes our offense a tougher cover. Do you know how easy it is to scout against this Bears offense? It's not a secret that Matt Forte is going to get the ball and teams can just hone in on stopping him because Devin Hester nor Johnny Knox pose any major threats. An elite offensive lineman can only be responsible for one man. Unfortunately, there are 4 other spots where guys can take advantage of. And as I've mentioned a couple hundred times before, extra time is only helpful when your receivers get open. How many coverage sacks have we seen already in the past two seasons from Cutler because nobody is open? That's why quality WR's make an offense. Look at what Atlanta went out and did this past year to get more explosive. They got Julio Jones to pair up with Roddy White who was already an All Pro receiver. There offensive line is almost just as bad as ours but Ryan has the luxury of his two security blankets to throw two (Well three if you count Tony Gonzalez). It's all about making your offense unpredictable. With no talented WR's on this team, it makes it awful easy to plan against this Bears offense. If you placed Brandon Marshall on this team right now, all of a sudden that's one other guy teams have to scheme for. And that alone opens up more opportunities for other guys to get open. Also, remember, when Jon Kitna was getting blasted on a weekly basis, the Mike Martz coached offense in Detroit was still fairly successful because he had a rookie Calvin Johnson and a younger more motivated Roy Williams.

He's my #1 target in this draft should we have the opportunity to draft him. Though, there are alot more worse teams than us that need WR's so I don't believe he will be in our range by the time we are selecting. We'd need to be in the top 10 to get either or the two Elite receivers but we should be within Floyd range (15-25). Either of those 3 would be gold for us. My order of preference would be 1. Jeffery 2. Blackmon 3. Floyd

Reggie Wayne would never resign here after what is going on with this offense. I wouldn't waste any picks for him. I might with Mathis however. The guy I think we should start making proposals to is Brandon Marshall. Yeah, he's a mess off the field and sometimes on it.. But could you imagine the big smile on Cutler's face if someone walked in and told him we got his guy back? I'd have to imagine both guys would become instantly rejuvenated and would finally give us that #1 play making WR that we've needed since forever now. I'd gladly offer that Carolina 3rd rounder for him if Miami is ready to clean house, since there season is going nowhere. Would probably even offer both 3rd rounders. Imagine doing that and then being able to draft Floyd, Blackmon, or Jeffery in the 1st round next year and the best available LT, C in the 2nd with a chance to sign Carl Nicks again as a FA? That would instantly change the dynamic of this team.

Yeah Charlie would have been good but I have a feeling he probably would have done the exact same thing as he did with the Chiefs.. Leave after one year. Maybe we can get Clements next year after we let Martz walk or try Bates again. Of course, if we end up having another piss poor year, it's going to be a less attractive place to coordinate at if the Bears don't fire Lovie.. Which I don't think they'll do unfortunately..

I'd like to see Mario Addison get a chance to start. He was in the backfield nearly every play this preseason, and he's athletic as hell.

Oh for God sakes he would not. Jerry Rice is the greatest receiver in the history of football. Great players are great no matter what. If you eliminate the 7 step drop, all of a sudden Cutler instantly has more time to throw because he gets to set his feet quicker. Again, I say.. An Elite WR is EVERY bit as important as an Elite Offensive lineman for this team. Time is only important when your receivers separate, and as you saw last Monday, sometimes that doesn't even make a difference because then they have to catch it, ie. Devin Hester..

Because our receivers kind of suck at catching passes, getting open, and making adjustments on balls? The Bears need an elite WR every bit as much as they need an elite offensive lineman. Brandon Lloyd isn't elite though but he's still worth a 4th or 5th round draft pick if that's what it takes to get him.

Get his ass here! Just shows you how desperate I am to get a quality WR in here. Brandon Lloyd is a #2/#1 receiver and would help Cutler out because he can adjust to some of his throws and come down with jump balls. He's like a poor mans Steve Smith with a different style. I would throw a 4th or 5th rounder at them and would go no higher than a 3rd.

Hated the Chris Conte pick to begin with. I guess we'll see exactly what he's made of on Sunday Night. I can't imagine him being able to bring down Adrian Peterson if he reaches that 2nd level. Of course, Merriwether and Major Wright are both terrible tacklers in their own right so.. We might as well see what we got now because we aren't going anywhere this season. I'd bench Idonije too because he's giving us next to nothing.. Put Addison or Henry Melton in his place and just have Idonije back to doing what he did before, special teams.

Totally different year. Last year, Detroit was at the bottom of the standings in the division, and now they are 5-0 along with GB. So the division race is already over. Our only shot is that last Wild card position, which would have to be a huge stroke of luck for 3 teams from the same division to make the playoffs.

Angelo should be on the phone with Miami now and see if they would be interested in dealing Brandon Marshall now that they are going nowhere. My guess says no but it's worth a call. Then again, Jerry says he likes our receivers that we already have..

Peppers has been on vacation all year anyways so it probably wouldn't matter if he was out there or not. I'd give Mario Addison a shot since Nick Reed is next to useless as a DE and Corey Wooton can't seem to get out of his own way to stay healthy.

Please Fire everybody and hire Jon Gruden as the head coach and get a coordinator that runs a west coast scheme. Gruden is a West Coast guy and would bring the fire that us fans have wanted for so long from our players and coaches instead of listening to Lovie and Jerry Angelo blatantly lie to our faces like we are idiots.

I don't think Lovie does much of anything out there, other than waste timeouts on 4th downs and challenge a call that had no chance of being overturned after taking one look at the replay. Tice does the yanking and pulling out there in regards to the Oline I'm assuming because Lovie apparently doesn't have anything to do with the WR's either. That's on Martz.

lol, put Management and Ownership on there as well. Time for an all out firesale with everyone except Jay and Matt Forte.

He'll be demanding another trade after the season is over unless we get him some help (WR, OL)

Nah. Get lineman through Free Agency or in the 2nd or 3rd round of the draft. We need play makers in the worst way. We have no #1 or #2 WR. Get Cutler some help now!