AZ54
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Posts posted by AZ54
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5 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
I'm not sure what exactly Williams' intangibles really are, too.
I have seen all the press about WIlliams being gay or trans or whatever, and I think it is possible he is, and it is possible he is trolling people for saying that, wearing the pink nails and phone, waving his hand in an effeminate manner. I think he might just well be an overcompetitive jerk putting his middle finger up to those calling him that. It reminds me of Jim McMahon wearing his headbands taking ont he league commissioner.
I think it is clear Caleb is never going to be a humble quiet teammate. He is not going to have options as a loveable and loyal backup if things go south. he is an in your face competitor, who has so far accomplished nothing in the NFL, but comes in postured to be an arrogant and fiery champion. If he falls he will fall hard in public opinion, but if he succeeds, he seems to have the heart of a real champion.
We may remember when we had McMahon, Tomczak and a rookie Harbaugh on our team. Tomczak was licking McMahons feet in the press, while Harbaugh said "Im here to compete to be the starter" and of course his competitive spirit is now legendary, having won championships coaching at every level, one of the best and top coaches of all time by the numbers.
We might also remember later when McMahon was a Packer, Tomczak signalling the plays over to him so the GB defense could destroy Harbaugh during a preseason game.
So of the three, Id take the personality of McMahon or Harbaugh as a team leader, and never a snitchy whiny loser like Tomczak.
I think of Jordan, Brady, Muhammad Ali, Deion Sanders, Mike Tyson, Kobe Bryant and others as a blueprint for this kind of leader. Of course there are other successful kinds too, Montana comes to mind.
But humility is not necessarily a virtue for a leader. And on a team with Eberflus as head coach, I dont mind at all if that fire comes from our QB. I wont mind if he is sometimes insubordinate, as long as his gambits work.
I think of that MNF football game in the early part of the 1985 season against the Vikings, where McMahon had been sick and in the hospital, but got out in time to play, standing next to Ditka on the sidelines with his helmet on, begging to play, while Ditka fumed and told him he was too sick to play, and the Vikings built a three score lead on us.
Ditka lost his cool, and put McMahon in angrily. The first play was a screen pass to Walter. Gault runs a go route on that left side to clear out the defense for Wlater to work underneath. There are no WR options on this play. The ball goes to Walter or no one. McMahon, stepped back and threw an 80 yard bomb for a touch down to Gault who was surprised to see the ball. Even he didnt know McMahon would do this.
That moment was the spark that made the 85 Bears into the cocky jerks that scared the rest of the league into submission. McMahon didnt have Ditkas blessing to do that - it wasnt humble it was outright insubordination, but it worked and a competitor become a champion.
There are similar stories about Lawrence Taylor freelancing too. And Dtika and Parcells are two of the hottest tempered disciplinarians in NFL history.
Caleb is all in, he will be "immortal" or bust. he will be arrogant, and at times perhaps insubordinate. But he will carry this team, kicking and screaming if necessary, to victories. I can imagine him getting pissed at early prevent defenses for example. And GOOD. This team needs leadership.
So If Caleb is trolling with his pink nails, or really is about to be the first openly gay QB, etiehr way if he is motivated to be legendary, then that chip on his shoulder is a beautiful thing.
The concern I guess is that he will take a knee and become an activist / victim. And I dont care what the cause, whether it be BLM, or Veterans Health care or whatever cause whoever is reading this thinks is very good and important, I think that kind of distractions hurt a teams Super Bowl chances, even if they do help society at large.
But everything I see from Caleb paints the opposite picture. He may be gay, and even speak about it in the press, but I see him as fighting for greatness. So it is less important to me what motivates him, than that he is so highly motivated.
I love Dennis Rodman. His style certainly allowed him a competitive advantage over players who's skin he got under. Same with McMahon, Jordan - you know the list.
So I hope he continues to be flamboyant and trollish. I dont even care if he is that black hatted wrestling type villian. As long as he is kicking people's asses, Im here for it.
So when we evaluate his quirks - let's not assume that being arrogant, lacking humility, being edgy or abrasive is always a bad thing. Let's instead take it in the context of success and dominance on the football field.
The 85 Bears defense used to bark at the LOS. That's pretty obnoxious, egotistical and disrespectful. And it scared the hell out of grown men. Because they backed it up. So the question is, could they have been as violent, highly motivated and intimidating if they had not included emotion in their game?
I cant wait to tell Packers fans "you dont like it? Beat us then and shut us up"
Didnt Rodgers do that to us? Isnt it our turn?Have you ever heard or seen Caleb saying he'd love to play for the Bears? All I've ever heard from him is that he'd love to be the #1 pick. For all the social media posts and interviews he does I'm still waiting for that.
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On 4/7/2024 at 5:33 PM, killakrzydav said:
Im glad Latu and another trade down or second round option are coming in
Worthy will go in round one. It’s not just speed he has some nuances to his route running that make him effective. He doesn’t have the best hands or he’d be in the top 20 discussion.
I’n other news I saw Steve Smith review Brian Thomas. I respect his opinions on WRs. He’s saying he’ll end up a #1 WR.
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2 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:
If we were to trade the one, I'm taking Maye. Best upside of ANY player in the draft. His floor isn't there yet though. We're drafting for next year, so he would have a year to take his lumps.
His arm is crazy good but I don’t like his pocket presence. I think he needs a full year to work on that stuff before being thrown into the fire. If he can get his feet to calm down that should lead to less missed easy passes.
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Slowly the talk of Jayden Daniels being the best QB in this draft gains traction. I haven't changed my position. I'm so far off the consensus mock because I'm still the only fan here who will trade back to #2 and take Daniels and the picks. I'd take Daniels at #1 and still be happy but I believe I can make that trade happen. Even the Bears fan I met at a my granddaughters softball game agreed with Daniels being the best so there's at least 2 of us in the multiverse LOL.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWbtESDDezQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C53IuDnGczM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Uxx0_v9t04
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6 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
Truth.
Turner is really an OLB type edge. His "type' is like Leonard Floyd, although I think Turner is a better player than Floyd.
Eberflus really is a 4-3 kind of guy. He is gonna want a DE that can play on first and second down too. This is part of why they say that the 3T makes the cover 2 go. Because you need DEs that can play contain on the run, because your LBs are back in zone, and you need to collapse the pocket a bit more from the DTs, since the DEs have to respect the run for a beat longer without LBers playing contain on the edge.
This is why I think Verse is a much better fit for Eberflus. If we go DL, I think it'll be verse or even a 3T before it'd be Turner.I agree we're more likely to take Verse over Turner as well. Part of that reason though is the lack of depth we've got at DE. Walker isn't bad though on run downs so having elite speed off the edge would be welcome in the mix. Maybe they swing big for the elite pass rush because Turner definitely has a skillset we don't have the on the roster. Ngakoue was never a bend-around-the-hoop type of DE, nor did he have elite quickness, speed, or power. At his age his one-trick pony show wasn't working anymore.
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It depends a bit on what you want. If you want the best pass rushing DE for third and long you grab Turner. He still has value as a run defender but not really the guy you want to anchor against the point of attack in the run game.
If you want a starting caliber NFL DE for every down you take Verse. He’s a beast who just will not be moved. His bull rush is so effective it’ll give Braxton Jones nightmares about practice. He has enough athleticism to work off that and get sacks.
if you were in group one then you might not care much if you trade back and get Latu.
The rest are JAGs.
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8 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:
I'm not sure how it's going to play out. I can imagine there will be a lot more trick plays like reverses and throwbacks.
It does basically kill the trick onside play, which is good because you get can get way too much value for a fluke. If you think your team is the stronger one, you dont want or need surprise onside kicks.
The good news is that apparently our own ST coach Hightower was one of the people pushing hardest for it, so he might have some stuff in mind about how to game this best.
We need a real kick returner now. I don't want Velus again. Maybe someone with a good arm who can throw to the other side, and runs really well in the open field. Damn! We shoulda kept Fields! LOL
(yeah I'm kidding, he'd never agree to be just a kick returner, and if he did, he'd be too expensive for that role. Hed probably be great at it though. I always thought of him as similar to Hester)Fields has speed but not a lot of wiggle. Neither does Patterson for that matter. It's guys like Hester that are so damn slippery when they cut without losing speed.
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56 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:
You can see it in the summer league, whatever it is called. They adapted it off of their rules.
XFL. But I still want to see it with NFL caliber athletes.
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I like it. I need to see it in action but this is a positive step forward and very appropriate considering Hester enters the HoF this year. Maybe enough people finally watched his highlights and realized how exciting those plays were and how much they missed them.
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8 hours ago, Stinger226 said:
If I hear this right Peters comments were before the 2023 season that could have changed but if true, I get why Daniels wouldn't like Peters. I'm not sure any rumors can be taken seriously before the draft. No one is telling you exactly what they're going to do. Even Poles with the first pick, stated he's taking Caleb but everything points to that.
Of course it s al rumor and innuendos. Have you got video or a link to that statement from Poles?
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Doing more research on the QBs...
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This is interesting...and I haven't heard this anywhere else. Now Daniels gets maybe 5% of the press coverage that Caleb Williams does so this stuff doesn't catch fire in the media in the same way. I just find it an odd twist to the rumors now that Daniels is reportedly at the top of their list at #2. Except for the report that came out after J.J. McCarthy's pro day saying they liked him at #2. Musical chairs with the QBs in the media all the way up to draft day.
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RAS is overrated as a metric IMO and even as the creator admitted it was never intended to become what it is today. But it is a nice summary and I like to use it as a quick reference for some basic athletic traits to see if it backs up the play on the field. Just as often players have a high RAS but aren't good football players. Dominique Robinson has a 9.73 RAS and still can't find the QB.
The two physical traits I think Poles has been the most clear about is OT and DE having long arms. I think that's also a physical trait he likes in DTs but I'm not sure it's as big a deal for IOL, maybe more of a nice to have.
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12 hours ago, Stinger226 said:
Inane comments? (There's some questions about Caleb? )
AZ posted the video, yet you question my beliefs that I buy into the videos.
I could care less that he sobs on his moms lap, paints his nails, or wears dresses. The only question I have is his ( I want to be treated special) attitude and how will that effect the team?
Does he hold out because he thinks the rookie pay scale isn't enough money for him? He so great he's going to change the way the NFL treats players?
He doesn't have an agent , didn't want to do medicals, he keeps doing things that project he wants to be treated differently.
When asked about where he wants to play, (whoever has the # 1 pick), we have the first pick but he choose to not mention our name. That seems odd to me how he answered that.
Let ‘'em get mad at me. I don’t care. My opinion is just my opinion. The best way to learn if I’m wrong is to publish it and see what the feedback is. We had a vigorous debate last year about the character of Jalen Carter. I don’t see any reason we shouldn’t be doing the same for our top ten picks this year.
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3 hours ago, adam said:
Do you think teams get that much out of pro days? At this point, at most it could be used as a tiebreaker, but I doubt it sways the pendulum very much.
Depends how it's scripted. Lamar Jackson mostly threw between the hashes at his pro day and guess what... that's mostly what he does in the NFL even in the past season. They are just throwing against air with no pressure and they've practiced everything in advance so I doubt that sways anyone much at all.
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22 minutes ago, Stinger226 said:
When talking about Field's, the money he would have had to pay going forward was a big reason, he had to change.
Money and timeline to wait for him to prove he's the guy. I would say it's more simply that he feels either Williams or Daniels will have his team in a better position in 2025.
I leave Maye out because he said the QB coach and maybe OC are going to his pro day but Poles is not. I'm not sure about Flus either. So it definitely feels like a 2 horse race and I have no clue, based on his words and expressions, who is in the lead right now other than the obvious Williams ranking #1 overall.
As noted above, I did catch him saying the #9 pick being key for OT, WR, or DE. If he trades back from 9 I don't think he goes far unless the reward is huge.
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3 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
I cant say you guys are wrong about the character questions, we each have our opinions, but you guys look at Williams' tape and you really don't see it? Not highlight (or lowlight) reels but game footage?
I'd be less surprised if someone said they didnt see the film, and were saying this - then of course, because there is so much on the web all over the place. But did you guys actually watch breakdown tape and come away thinking Williams wasnt head and shoulders above the other guys?I see a compilation of really good along with stuff that looks like Justin searching for the big play and ignoring the easy one. On some of those easy plays I think you recognize that he is going through all his reads. Can he play on time and in rhythm? Yes.
I have other concerns about how he throws when under pressure in the pocket. Those off angle throws will lead to trouble in the NFL. How does that bad habit translate to the NFL for a shorter QB?
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17 minutes ago, Bill said:
If we can get three 1's and two 2's I will take any of the three. Noting less give me Williams. How much did 49''s trade for Wilson
Trey Lance?
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On 3/23/2024 at 4:10 PM, Stinger226 said:
Do they do any visits to hide who they really might want to draft? He's a blue chip player, just checking out all options or deflecting ?
With Waldron calling plays this is likely legit interest. He’s not opposed to putting 3 TE in the field.
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1 minute ago, BearFan PHX said:
AZ54, cool - so a gentleman's bet?
You're on record saying you'd take Daniels over Williams, and I'm the opposite.
Let's see how they do the first year, then after year 2 and year 3, and see which prediction worked out?Sure. I don't normally bet because I usually lose, but maybe we meet up across town and the loser buys the whiskey. I'd say these two QBs are going 1-2 in this draft and Washington has a decent team, as do we in many aspects.
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32 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:
Do you see greatness in any of the prospects? I see glimpses from all of them.
Each of them have some elite traits yes. Slightly different in each one.
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At this point Jayden Daniels is QB1 for me. I reviewed some more Drake Maye film today and I agree with the assessment that he's really talented but he needs a year to learn. In terms of QBs ready to play year 1, which is obviously what Poles sees since he traded away Fields, we have 2: Wiliams or Daniels.
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1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said:
The NFL is a business. If you get injured, they spit you out. If they like someone else, they trade you or cut you. You're a piece of meat to them. That's why there is a collective bargaining agreement, and a union. That's why there are agents.
Does anyone think teams go easy on agents? or that agents go easy on teams? Of course not. These teams are multi billion dollar businesses and everyone is competing for money and wins.
If Caleb thinks he's special, and his price tag shows he's special, then great. No one is making anyone draft him, but they want to, so he should get as much as he can, just as teams should give as little as they can.
And is Caleb special? Yes it seems that he is. It's OK for him to know it, and to reach for the stars.
So Calebs father met with agents to see if they could find a way to get him more highly paid than the slotted salary. They told him there was no way to do that. OK. Same with team ownership. When you have the hot hand in sports or Hollywood, you play it, because tomorrow you can be cast aside. I dont blame them for asking.
I havent heard anything from Caleb about sitting out. I heard Calebs father complain about how the draft order allocates the best players to the worst teams. He said that before we fired Getsy. He said that before we had Keenan Allen. He probably said that before he realized that Chicago had the first pick by trade and not having a 3 win season.
I think those videos are cherry picked, and deceptively edited out of context and time.
I do sense a kind of nervousness or arrogance in Caleb. It's a lot to put on a young man's shoulders. I can feel that
But the dress wearing, the nail painting all that - it's silliness. The guy can play at a really high level or he can't. Surely Williams isn't leaving room for a beloved backup's career if it all goes poorly. He's not going to win the most humble guy in the league award. But so what? He's got no backup plan but greatness. He says he wants to be "immortal" in NFL history. Shouldnt we WANT that?
Jordan was like this too. So was Brady, and even Sweetness. Deion Sanders, Dennis Rodman, Joe Namath, Jim McMahon, Kobe Bryant, Muhammad Ali, Mike Tyson, Ray Lewis - and there are more examples of brash overcompetitive legends.
I agree that if WIlliams doesnt grow into an NFL monster within a few years, this will all age very poorly on him. It's a risk. But it's also evidence of him being highly internally motivated. He is the opposite of Jay Cutler. He is in it to kick EVERYONES ass. He cares! He cried when he couldnt win without a team around him.
I like it, and if he can back it up, then I LOVE it.
Dont you all remember the arrogance of the 85 defense? They released a song called Superbowl shuffle in week 11!
It's just been so long. Dont be afraid of greatness! Dont be afraid of having a player who IS special. And if he makes waves and pulls overly conservative coaches kicking and screaming into superbowl wins, then he's the guy we've been waiting for.
I thought that identity would come with a new head coach like Harbaugh. But it can be the QB. He can lead from that position too.Other than his pocket presence I don't even see the greatness on the field. If he were all that then yeah, but he isn't.
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The more I see of this kid the more I flat out dislike him as a person. I simply don't care about his football talent and I'd never hire him. I find it hard to believe this is the leader Ryan Poles wants at the podium after a tough loss. So be it.
Someone criticized me because I don't like him painting his fingernails. If he wants to be all pretty that's on him but now I find out he was writing F-Utah, and then follows that up with F- ND. Then he's promoting that across social media. He's an utterly classless individual. When asked about the F-ND, he refers to fans as "the sheep" who will never understand what it's like to walk in his shoes. On that he's correct, I won't walk in his shoes because I'd never want to treat people like that.
The look on everyone's faces as he completely ignored Keenan Allen and walks right by him was awesome. Someone had to call him over, likely a PR person for USC. I refuse to believe that someone with his "vision on the field" couldn't see that bright orange jacket Allen was wearing as soon as he was walking onto the field. An elite NFL WR took the time to attend your pro day you take the time to find him and thank him.
I said a week ago I was out on this kid and now I'm even more so. Give him away to Wash and go draft Maye who also has elite arm talent. I don't even know about Maye's attitude yet as I've barely done any research on him.
The Chicago Bears are on the clock! OFFSEASON OPEN THREAD!
in Bearstalk
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I see Williams doing a whole lot of hero ball. I see him survey the field but just as often ignore the easy wide open underneath route. Or often bypass the late opening read in the middle. I see him fast and loose with the ball when he scrambled. I see him throw up prayers when under pressure. He has a Gumby arm, quick release. Great pocket awareness. I see a whole lot of Kyler Murray. Taller but not as fast.
The best defense is a great offense. Control the ball control the clock and keep your defense of the field. That’s what worries me because that’s not how he played the game and even your assessment agrees with that. He tried to put up 40 every game. Take the open short route and maybe you win with 25pts.
Elite 2min left game winning drives don’t require as much talent as smarts. I would like to have seen him do more death by a thousand cut type drives mixed in with the big plays.
The talent is all there but what I see on film leads to the part I’ll never know. Is he humble enough to know what he doesn’t know and work to improve?
For such an obvious first overall pick Poles has put in a lot of effort to figure that out. On the other hand he’s seemingly done none of that with any other prospect. Why? Why make it blatantly obvious to the world you are only courting one QB yet refuse to say he’s your choice at #1?
From a career standpoint Poles might survive drafting Williams if he fails. Draft anyone else and that’s not likely unless it’s a home run.