Lucky Luciano

hester never went to a pro-bowl or voted all-pro because of his defensive back skills or receiving skills. it was solely as a a special teams player to my knowledge. in this post i did not list any special team players in the statistics as starters.

i just don't see webb at this point other than a below average LT. the holding penalties, false starts certainly count in the evaluation of any offensive lineman the same as the missed asignments and missed blocks. plus how is the run blocking on the left side of the line? doesn't that count a lot also in tackle evaluation? what tools are you talking about that isn't listed on nearly every draft evaluation of players ever produced? doesn't frank ohmy have those same tools? sporatic good games do not make a solid consistant player. could he develop? sure, but do you really want to bet the farm on him and risk injury to your franchise QB gambling he will get better over the next 2-3 years without any alternate plan in effect? the players we are fielding... LT - an undrafted walk-on, LG - a first round pick at tackle who couldn't cut it there, C - an aging free agent who never played center before in the NFL, RG - a free agent who was released by his former team where HE played center, RT - a 7th round draft pick who was listed as a guard and has played inconsistently at tackle. to me there is a very good reason players are drafted in the rounds they are and that is mental and physical talent and experience in college against the best competition (i know there are always exceptions to the rule). could webb, c. williams, and l. louis turn into exceptional players? yes. but with the little experience we have watched so far it is NOT a safe bet any of them will be other than average/good backups. as far as drafting other players and benching the current starters: i never said that. what i did say is draft good potential talent (higher round draft picks) and let them really compete in training camp. if the rookies are not up to it yet then let them sit and learn while starting the BEST player at that position. as far as url and pepperman, these guys have a closing window on their talents. do we want to ignore the health of this franchises future to start mediocre players at a super important position and risk the health of a player who is the franchise ticket for the next 8-10 years? absolutely not. i have no idea where stats like those could be found and if anybody can please post them for us all. the only thing i can do is observe what is happening on the field every gameday. to me i am seeing webb miss assignments that caused not only hanie problems but caused cutler to have to scramble to avoid pressure or just plain get racked. this even with TE or FB help to block on that side there have been problems. can i tell you specifically which play or even game? no. i have no way to watch any film or replay other than what is broadcast at the time. it is happening all over the offensive line. on one play they push in the left side, the next the right, and if that is not bad enough they come up the middle. every time? no, but enough that no QB can feel comfort back there for more than a heartbeat. one more comment... the holding plays are generally what happens when you get beat as an offensive lineman. so to me nearly every holding call could have just as easily been a recorded sack.

of course some coaching issues would apply in some instances but does player quality mean nothing to you? compare 'most' of the first day pick rosters against ours and the number and quality of players that are on their roster compared to ours. to me it is pretty telling. this doesn't even take into account the number of 1st day pick pro-bowl/all-pro players each team is sporting and comparing that to jerry angelo's draft picks which are TWO throughout the rosters from 2005 onward. NOT someone else in our organization who drafted urlacher, kreutz and mike brown. so don't you think 4 years is long enough for angelo's draft picks to develop? if not then look at the number of first day picks that were all-pro/pro-bowl players up to present on our roster. the only team that equals us is the freaking oakland raiders with 'two' all-pro/pro-bowl players (the same as angelo's picks) on their roster and then look at their following 8 year records in the nfl. for that matter look at ours. other than the raiders, i believe we are one of 3 teams in the last 20-30+ years that never even made the playoffs for 3 straight years after a superbowl appearance. hmmm... doesn't GS in NFL statistical data mean the number of games started for that player in a season? if not i guess i 'could' be wrong. but if GS does mean 'games started' maybe you should try your own "observational skills" on the links below and by all means let me know how i did (unless you don't believe their credibility or conclusions either). NFL official website: http://www.nfl.com/player/marcusharrison/2348/profile PRO-FOOTBALL-REFERENCE: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HarrMa98.htm EDIT NOTE: i never said m. harrison was a starter in 2010. i said in - 2009 - talk about observational skills

in my opinion we are again hoping that a player who had 4-5 'good' games not even playing guard is going to turn into an elite player over the next 10 years (not even mentioning if chris williams will do the same). add to this factor that garza is an average, at best, center who is aging and we SHOULD have drafted kreutz/garza's replacement 2 years ago. it is just too risky to not draft high to find good+ offensive linemen who will keep cutler off the IR.

"no way" the bronco's can win in 16 seconds? didn't i just give you an example of losing a game to the falcons with ELEVEN SECONDS on the clock in atlanta and not in denver where the field goal kickers are hitting at well over 50 yards? also i was talking about hanie killing the clock not barber. with as much time as was on the clock when we literally gave them the touchdown if we had played the type of defense we had all game we should have been able to kill a hell of a lot more time than it took them to score instead of hoping hanie could play out a first down in the following series.

to me the key word in your paragraph is this... "played fairly well". this seems to be the problem this franchise has had for 10+ years and quite frankly is the reason we have poor quality players at key positions and no depth or players on our roster to replace them. that problem to me is the mentality of not drafting a potentially better/high quality player who may not start or contribute immediately (believe me i do understand the concept of todays salary cap and free agent restrictions in this regard). quarterbacks and offensive linemen are the prime examples of you having to draft players that will/may take time to develop on your roster rather than throwing them into the fire so to speak unless you have the luxury of already having a developed, very good, offensive line that you only need to plug one player into as a starter and can compensate for with veteran experienced players playing next to him or around him (like a good blocking fullback or tight ends). players that are playing "fairly well" at this position can and will contribute to ending the career of your franchise quarterback (or even your running back if he is taking a pounding hitting non-existent holes in the line week after week). is this risk really worth it? yet this franchise always looks at the poor, or at best average, player that may play better than a rookie SHORT TERM and make their decisions based upon that. ever wonder why we usually need to replace MULTIPLE linemen all at once? it is because we never plan ahead as to age or quality and end up having to hope to hell we can draft 3 or 4 offensive linemen in one draft that are worth a dam or find yet another aging free agent. it just does not work that way usually. you need to keep looking at the future in these particular instances and draft quality players over a period of years. here is an example: let us say webb does turn into an average LT. do you not want to upgrade that to an excellent, all-pro type of player? i sure do. this holds true to every position on the line. let's say you do find 2 young studs at the same position. wouldn't you like to be able to trade one for some real compensation to another team and keep your best player in chicago? i have to ask... what is a 'fair' amount of sacks you want your franchise quarterback to absorb from the play of a questionable player and in this case from your qb's blindside? to me that is insane to risk the health of the rarest and hardest to find player on your roster. it took us how many decades and wasted draft picks to find a franchise qb? why risk the health of this franchise to go the cheap route and hope for the best from an iffy player? if we draft a high potential player to play LT (or any line position for that matter) and webb/others still outperforms him then so be it. let webb start until he is either in the elite category or draft another to push him/them out.

along with the packers you can put the steelers in that category. their drafting has been excellent over the years and in my opinion due in large part to very smart football people running and in their franchise.

i have compiled this information to illustrate the importance of drafting well and particularly drafting well in rounds 1-3 if you want to participate in a superbowl. also, i believe the quality of those draft picks is PARAMOUNT to the health and competiveness of your team yet if you look at the bears roster, the number of quality players drafted in these rounds by jerry angelo is exceptionally poor. below are listed all superbowl participents since jerry angelo became GM and participated in the bears draft choices below. I have also listed below all of the bear rosters to date for comparrison. feel free to copy this information for future references if you wish. 2002 tampa bay - superbowl champs 11 starters drafted 8 first day picks – *FB mike alstott, RG cosey coleman, RT kenyatta walker, LDT ‘booger’ mcfarland, *RDT warren sapp, *RLB derrick brooks, LCB brian kelly, *RCB ronde barber, *SS john lynch. 5 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. oakland - losers 10 starters drafted 9 first day picks – WR jerry porter, LG mo collins, LG matt stinchcomb, *C barret robbins, LDE delawrence grant, RDE tony bryant, MLB napoleon harris, *LCB charles woodson, SS derrick gibson. 2 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. 2003 new england - superbowl champs 16 starters drafted 11 first day picks – RB kevin faulk, WR deion branch, WR bethel johnson, TE daniel graham, *LT matt light, *LG damien woody, *RDT richard seymour, *RDE willie mcginest, *MLB tedy bruschi, *LCB ty law, FS eugene wilson. 6 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. carolina panthers - losers 11 starters drafted 10 first day picks – *WR muhsin muhammad, *WR steve smith, TE mike seidman, *RT jordan gross, *LDE julius peppers, *RDT kris jenkins, *RDT mike rucker, *MLB dan morgan, RLB will witherspoon, LCB ricky manning, SS mike minter, FS deon grant. 7 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. 2004 new england - superbowl champs 15 starters drafted 11 first day picks - WR deion branch, TE daniel graham, *LT matt light, LDE ty warren, *NT vince wilfork, *RDE richard seymour, *LOLB willie mcginest, LILB ted johnson, *MLB tedy bruschi, *LCB ty law, FS eugene wilson. 6 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. eagles - losers 14 starters drafted 14 first day picks - *QB donovan mcnabb, *RB brian westbrook, WR freddie mitchell, WR tod pinkston, TE l.j. smith, *LT tra thomas, RG jermane mayberry, LDT corey simon, RDE derrick burgess, *MLB jeremiah trotter, *LCB lito sheppard, RCB sheldon brown, *SS michael lewis, *FS brian dawkins. 7 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. 2005 steelers - superbowl champs 18 starters drafted 12 first day picks – *QB ben roethlisberger, WR antwaan randle el, *WR hines ward, *TE heath miller, *LT marvel smith, *LG alen faneca, RG kendall simmons, RT max starks, *NT casey hampton, *ROLB joey porter, *SS troy polamalu, *FS chris hope. 9 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. seahawks - losers 14 starters drafted 12 first day picks - *RB shaun alexander, WR darrell jackson, TE jerramy stevens, *LT walter jones, *LG steve huchinson, RT sean locklear, RDT marcus tubbs, LOLB leroy hill, *MLB lofa tatupu, *RCB marcus trufant, SS michael boulware, *FS ken hamlin. 6 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. 2006 colts - superbowl champs 17 starters drafted 10 first day picks - *QB peyton manning, *RB joseph addai, *WR marvin harrison, *WR reggie wayne, *TE dallas clark, *LT tarik glenn, *RDE dwight freeney, LLB gilbert gardner, LLB rob morris, FS marlin jackson. 7 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. bears - LOSERS 16 bear drafted starters 11 first day picks – QB rex grossman, RB cedric benson, WR bernard berrian, *C olin kreutz, *LDT tommy harris, RDT tank johnson, *MLB brian urlacher, *RLB lance briggs, CB charles tillman, *SS mike brown, FS danieal manning. 5 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. jerry angelo drafted two of them. ***SEE BELOW… 2007 giants - superbowl champs 15 starters drafted 9 first day picks – *QB eli manning (swap 1st picks), WR amani toomer, *TE jeremy shockey, *RG chris snee, *LDE michael strahan, *RDE osi umenyiora, LLB mathias kiwanuka, LCB aron ross, *RCB sam madison. 6 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. patriots - losers 18 starters drafted 12 first day picks – RB kevin faulk, RB laurence maroney, TE ben watson, *LT matt light, *LG logan mankins, RT nick kaczur, LDE ty warren, *NT vince wilfork, *RDE richard seymour, *RILB tedy bruschi, RCB ellis hobbs, FS eugene wilson. 5 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. 2008 steelers - superbowl champs 17 starters drafted 11 first day picks – *QB ben roethelisberger, WR santonio holmes, *WR hines ward, *TE heath miller, TE matt spaeth, LT max starks, *LT marvel smith, *NT casey hampton, *LOLB lamarr woodley, RCB bryant mcfadden, *SS troy polamalu. 7 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. cardinals - losers 16 starters drafted 12 first day picks - *WR anquan boldin, *WR larry fitzgerald, TE leonard pope, RG deuce lutui, RT levi brown, *RDT darnell dockett, MLB gerald hayes, RLB karlos dansby, *RCB dominique cromartie, RCB eric green, *SS adrian wilson, *FS antrel rolle. 6 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. 2009 saints - superbowl champs 14 starters drafted 10 first day picks – RB reggie bush, WR devery henderson, WR robert meachem, *RT jon stinchcomb, LDE charles grant, RDT sedrick ellis, *RDE will smith, RCB tracy porter, RCB malcolm jenkins, *SS roman harper. 3 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. colts - losers 18 starters drafted 10 first day picks - *QB peyton manning, *RB joseph addai, *WR reggie wayne, *TE dallas clark, RG mike pollak, *RDE dwight freeney, LLB philip wheeler, LCB kelvin hayden, LCB tim jennings, RCB jerraud powers. 5 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. 2010 packers - superbowl champs 17 starters drafted 11 first day picks – *QB aaron rodgers, RB brandon jackson, *WR greg jennings, TE jermichael finley, *LT chad clifton, LG daryn colledge, RT bryan bulaga, NT b. j. raji, *LOLB clay matthews, LILB a. j. hawk, *FS nick collins. 5 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. steelers - losers 20 starters drafted 15 first day picks - *QB ben roethlisberger, RB rashard mendenhall, WR mike wallace, *WR hines ward, *TE heath miller, TE matt spaeth, LT max starks, *C maurkice pouncey, RG trai essex, LDE evander hood, *NT casey hampton, *LOLB lamarr woodley, RILB lawrence timmons, LCB bryant mcfadden, *SS troy polamalu. 7 *pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. ================================================================ bears 2001 roster angelo inherited 14 starters drafted by bears – 10 first day picks - anthony thomas, marty booker, dez white, david terrell, rex tucker, olin kreutz, brian urlacher, walt harris, tony parrish, mike brown. remaining bear starters drafted by bears (second day picks) – G chris villarrial, LLB rosey colvin, RLB warrick holdman, CB jerry azumah. starting free agents/undrafted – QB jim miller, RT big cat williams, FB daimon shelton, TE fred baxter, TE john davis, LT blake brockermeyer, LDT ted washington, RDT keith traylor, LDE bryon robinson, RDE phillip daniels, RCB r.w. mcquarters. =========================================================== after 4 years of drafts this is what angelo’s first day draft picks looked like… bears 2005 roster: 13 starters drafted by bears 7 first day pick starters - *C olin kreutz, RG terrence metcalf, *RDT tommy harris, *MLB brian urlacher, *RLB lance briggs, LCB charles tillman, *SS mike brown. angelo’s FOUR 1st day pick starters: terrence metcalf, *tommy harris (2004), *lance briggs (2003), charles tillman (2003). 2 pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. ***2006 – superbowl season 16 starters drafted by bears 11 first day pick starters – QB rex grossman, RB cedric benson, WR bernard berrian, *C olin kreutz, *LDT tommy harris, RDT tank johnson, *MLB brian urlacher, *RLB lance briggs, LCB charles tillman, *SS mike brown, FS danieal manning. angelo’s eight 1st day pick starters: rex grossman, cedric benson, bernard berrian, *tommy harris, tank johnson, *lance briggs, charles tillman, danieal manning. 2 pro-bowl/all-pro player starters during their careers. ALL devin hester pro-bowl/all-pro appearances due to special teams. bears 2007 roster: 13 starters drafted by bears 7 first day pick starters – FS danieal manning, LCB charles tillman, *RLB lance briggs, *MLB brian urlacher, *RDT tommy harris, *C olin kreutz, LG terrence metcalf, WR bernard berrian, RB cedric benson, QB rex grossman. angelo’s eight 1st day pick starters: rex grossman, cedric benson, bernard barrian, terrence metcalf, *tommy harris, *lance briggs, charles tillman, daniel manning. 2 pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. bears 2008 roster: 17 bear drafted starters 11 first day pick starters - *FS mike brown, LCB charles tillman, *RLB lance briggs, *MLB brian urlacher, *RDT tommy harris, NT dusty dvoracek, *C olin kreutz, TE greg olsen, *WR marty booker, WR devin hester, RB matt forte. angelo’s eight 1st day pick starters: RB matt forte, WR devin hester, TE greg olsen, NT dusty dvoracek, *RDT tommy harris, *RLB lance briggs, LCB charles tillman, FS daniel manning. 2 * pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. by this time we got rid of these angelo first day pick starters…benson our starting running back, berrian our #1 receiver, tank johnson our starting LDT. bears 2009 roster: 16 bear drafted starters 11 first day pick starters – RB matt forte, WR earl bennet, WR devin hester, TE greg olsen, LT/RT chris williams, *C olin kreutz, *LDT tommy harris, RDT marcus harrison, *LLB lance brigs, LCB charles tillman, FS danieal manning. angelo’s ten 1st day pick starters: RB matt forte, WR devin hester, WR earl bennet, TE greg olsen, LT/RT chris williams, *LDT tommy harris, RDT marcus harrison, *LLB lance briggs, LCB charles tillman, FS daniel manning. 2 * pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. by this time we got rid of these angelo first day pick starters… rex grossman our starting QB, dusty dvoracek our previous starting NT, terrence metcalf our previous starting LG. bears 2010 roster: 12 bear drafted starters 10 first day pick starters – RB matt forte, WR devin hester, TE greg olsen, LG chris williams, *C olin kreutz, *LDT tommie harris, *LLB lance briggs, *MLB brian urlacher, RCB charles tillman, SS danieal manning. angelo’s eight 1st day pick starters: RB matt forte, WR devin hester, TE greg olsen, LG chris williams, *LDT tommy harris, *LLB lance briggs, RCB charles tillman, SS danieal manning. 2 * pro-bowl/all-pro players during their careers. bears 2011 roster: this season we got rid of these angelo first day pick starters… greg olsen our starting TE, marcus harrison our previous starting RDT, danieal manning our starting SS. TAKE NOTE: during angelo’s tenure the two pro-bowl/all-pro players he drafted in rounds 1-3 were tommy harris and lance briggs. that is it!! also compare the actual quality of the players he drafted in rounds 1-3 (first day picks) to other superbowl teams. it is amazing to me this guy is still employed anywhere in the NFL in the capacity of a GM when you look at his record.

sorry but i have to disagree. although barber made two glaring errors it NEVER should have come down to that type of situation in the first place. the coaching staff to me gets just as much if not more blame as barber. this is not like some fluke that this cover 2 run by lovie has failed miserably and this time it has failed us right out of the playoffs. how can it be any surprise that when your corners and safeties play so far off the LOS they are beyond the first down markers and STILL backpeddling that they will give up a lot of yards, first downs and scores in a very short period of time? it's like being on the practice field for any QB to have receivers that wide open. even bad ones like t-bow. to go into this soft of a pass defense with that much time on the clock, when you have seen place kickers hitting easily over 50 yards because you are in denver, your defensive line is plain TIRED and it shows, and you have a 2nd string QB who has not moved the ball in 3.8 quarters enough to trust him to KILL the clock is just plain poor coaching. as far as denver getting the ball with 16 seconds left instead of 56... anybody at all remember the game against the freaking atlanta falcons a year or so ago when we had THAT game won also with 11 SECONDS left and they drive 50+ yards (or whatever the hell it was) to score the winning field goal??????? we have seen this time and time again and it just does NOT work consistently yet this coaching staff still believes it actually does without reservations.

i believe it was a legitimate question by the media that had to be asked that most everyone knew wouldn't be answered. i don't believe the hindsight 20/20 scenario is applicable here. that was a high risk call given the game situation, position and down. throwing against the grain is dangerous for any QB let alone one without even 1 game as a starter in the NFL in the freaking red zone where defenses are condensed into a 10 yard zone. for proof of that look what happened with cutler on the same call in a previous game. A. new orleans was the 2nd game of the season. i think by the time any message was sent or received it was probably after the detroit loss. that said, even if it were after the packer loss, that is three games into the season. does it usually take TWO to FOUR horrible games for a 'supposedly good' head coach to finally force a change (he was also getting crucified by the media) that should have been a halftime adjustment? don't you think it is important to protect the only franchise QB we have had in almost 30 years from career ending injury or death? didn't we run into offensive problems LAST season in the same vein as this? so i have to ask, doesn't lovie even watch what is going on offensively in practice or get a legitimate idea what the freaking game plan is from his offensive coordinator prior to gameday? is it some kind of surprise to him every week what our offense does on the field? B. did i ever say he should publicly rip into his coaches? no. but, with that said do you really need to antagonize the press for doing their job of asking hard questions when warranted? to me the statements "No. Maybe from you it is." and "next time it will" said it all about the coaches attitude during his press conference. this is not some new way lovie handles his duties of holding these. he has done this for years. so just what is his job description to you if he needs no knowledge of offense or defense? if he is not responsible for whether the offense or defense works week to week, is it just calling time outs and giving press conferences? if those are his key roles he even does that poorly. do you think lovie has a real grasp of offense with or without hanie at qb? i'm not talking X's and O's but the general concept on how they plan to attack teams each week and whether it is working or not and how to adjust during a game by giving input to is OC? you don't believe that is important? as far as defense, this IS lovie's show. that is why we ended up with marineli (sp) as DC after TWO LONG years of babich failing miserably and lovie himself failing for another. isn't marineli another coach that fits lovie's scheme? didn't we see rivera fired because he wanted to expand on other defensive ideas and concepts? this idea of lovie being appreciated by the players to me is just not that important to me as long as it doesn't get like the wanny regime. of course they like him. they also liked dick jauron. that does NOT make either one a good+ head coach.

i could live with that easily if we go for a LT in the first.

i certainly would like to see him given a shot at the spot he PLAYED in college at. if he is not quick enough to play the position then move him back to RT. if it played out that he could fill in the LT position better than average we would not have to worry about a high #1 pick to fill the spot which is a major plus for one of the premier spots in the NFL to find good players for.

i have to ask, lovie is appreciated by who? i agree that throwing players and coaches under the bus to the media is usually counterproductive but to state nonsense and attack the media, for no logical reason, is not productive either ("No. Maybe from you it is."). this goes back to the image lovie portrays of being stubborn and arrogant to a fault and in my opinion makes him look foolish trying to justify bad or questionable coaching decisions (or for that matter bad COACHES). it has happened in past years when bad play calling and poor clock management leaked over into future games when lovie tried to justify his poor decisions in the red zone after stating the same tripe as in this article to the press, "next time it will" or "I'd do it again". it is a very poor coaching practice to risk losing a game just to try and prove a point. next... 1. does anybody in the world at this point believe lovie is going to attack his HAND PICKED coaching staff? let's face it, there really are not many options left out there for him to choose from. 2. does it also lead one to believe that lovies knowledge of an offense is practically zero? how can you criticize something you have no clue about?

i agree that he is probably the best corner on this squad which is sad to say. we have basically ignored the CB position as much as we have ignored the offensive line position since angelo took over. at this point in peanuts career i am not 'sure' if he can be moved to a safety position. he is just running out of time in the NFL and the extra physical abuse a safety takes might be too much for him to absorb, not counting the amount of time it would take him to convert successfully. it just seems a shame that this coaching staff and GM have wasted a truly talented players career in a position he had a limited role in during his early stages as a CB. as far as jackson, i really know nothing about the guy at all. i just assumed he has an abundance of speed with the size and watching peanut, even with the cushion, trailing him by a step or more led me to that conclusion. if that is wrong then maybe the coaching staff just misplayed the way peanut should have been used in the game. on a final note... can you imagine how good our safeties would have been with mike brown and charles tillman playing together at that position? especially if we had addressed the CB position in 2006 by bringing in charles woodson as i wanted to at the time? we would have had maybe the best linebacking corp and defensive backs in the entire NFL!!!

i agree that peanut is very good in run support and very good at stripping the ball and in my opinion a very smart football player. what i do contest is the most important aspect for a good+ #1 cornerback in the NFL and that is his ability to play tight man coverage off the line of scrimmage. that is the pinnacle of his job description and separates the men from the boys. to say peanut can do this consistently is just not true because of the physical limitations he has. he is just not quick enough or fast enough to play up on the fast/quick key receivers in todays NFL. jackson in the last game was a prime example. steve smith of the panthers was another example of this with an exclamation point. everything you described in your post is the key qualities of an excellent safety!!

well, to me it is very realistic calling him a decent/good #2 corner. that he has been our best corner for years is a testament at how poorly we have drafted since angelo arrived. a VERY GOOD/GREAT #1 corner usually does not play 5-10 yards off the LOS every down but can and usually does play up on his man and bump him at the LOS to throw off the timing and cover him closely as he moves through his route. this is more true and important than in the past with the new rules designed with the 5 yard chuck rule that gives a receiver an unimpeded route if you don't. very good corners just plain don't get passes thrown in their direction nearly as often, even at #1 receivers, because teams compensate their passing attack by throwing more at the weaker defensive players. so if you want to look up meaningful statistics, look up how much yardage he has given up in his passes defended vs. your HOF #1 cornerback candidates you mention. in my estimation, if you want to compare picks, forced fumbles and recoveries then compare him to what a very good safety has done in the same system, john lynch. if the powers that be in our coaching staff had half the brains they think they have, peanut would have been playing safety for the last umpteen years and really been a candidate for the HOF and a perennial pro-bowler. i really like peanut and his ability to strip the ball from opponents is some of the best i have ever seen. but if you are seriously putting him in a category with HOF corners i am not even remotely going to buy into that.

peanut is what he is... a decent #2 CB and certainly not a pro-bowl caliber corner. if he would have been moved to free safety 6-7 years ago he would have been an all-world, all-pro player at that position. this coaching staff, for whatever reason, just never saw this and kept him at the position we initially drafted him to do even though the NFL changed. peanut was drafted and put into service as a larger corner who could play tight coverage on the bigger (and usually slower) receivers in our division like moss and the big receivers from green bay (can't think of their names at the moment). this he did very well until the NFL started going with the smaller, faster and quicker WR's which peanut just does not have the speed to cover off the LOS. the differences between last week and this week are prime examples of his strengths and weaknesses. if he can physically run with the receivers he can play up and bump-and-run man coverage and do very well. if not you will see exactly what you saw yesterday with a quick/fast receiver. he will drop back 4-8 yards off the LOS and backpeddle at the snap trying to contain in which you eventually get eaten alive or give up the 5-10 yard easy reception that opposing qb's have done to us for years. that is why the safety help from conte yesterday was critical to stop jackson and the rookie just did not have the experience or speed to do so. conclusion: it's not peanut, it is our coaching staff that has failed to adjust correctly in this aspect for years on end.

i am going to agree with jason. this team needs to draft GOOD offensive linemen early and often. every time this team has a couple of good games (which can't even be said for our OL in this game) we think we are set for a decade. as i have stated in the past you have to draft for the future when quarterbacks or offensive linemen are thrown into the equation. it usually takes 2-3 years for an offensive lineman to get up to speed in the NFL. to top this off, we are using max protection on many sets and even that is not working consistently to give cutler the needed protection. even IF any of our players turn out to be pro-bowl players how can it hurt to hedge our bet by drafting quality linemen? if a newly drafted player is better than what we got, who cares who starts as long as it's a quality player. this also gives us trade bait if we have a glut of excellent linemen. it's a fact, the most important position on this team is quarterback and we finally have a qb who i believe could win us multiple superbowls if kept healthy. so how can drafting good offensive linemen not be a priority? if nothing else look at the packers. they try to draft quality linemen in nearly every draft and it shows. GUARD: to say spenser is a long term solution at guard or center is a huge stretch. even our other guards, lance louis and chris williams, have not shown consistency to the point that you don't cover these positions with good draft picks. at the least we need to draft one very good first day pick at guard. TACKLE: web certainly can't be penciled in or considered even in the top 20 left tackles in the NFL. so to draft a potential LT should be a priority. at right tackle? although carimi has potential we again haven't seen enough of him due to injury to make any definite decisions that are set in stone. hell, it's even possible that carimi could be given a shot at LT since he played that in college. in any case drafting a good tackle should still be a top priority. CENTER: although garza has been a decent replacement at center he is certainly not a pro-bowl caliber center. add to this his age and a replacement at center is absolutely warranted by drafting a player to take over in the near future. DEPTH: this is virtually nonexistent.

1. have i ever said that an air coryell offense is the only passing system that i would want to be implemented in chicago? no. do i believe that that type of offense or a variation of it would work in chicago with a good OC and good player personnel? yes. for some unknown reason chicago fans believe that the only type of football that will work in chicago when it gets below freezing is a running pound the ground offense. this couldn't be more untrue. 2. would game plan adjustments have to be made in a high wire passing offense due to some week by week weather conditions that occur in winter months? absolutely. but to discount a passing offense altogether because we play in chicago in a cold environment is nonsense. first of all the entire NFL is now geared for a passing game due to rule changes and not to do so leads to a great disadvantage that i don't believe can be overcome if your goal is to win multiple superbowls. second, there are some pretty proficient passers and pass oriented offenses that made careers in cold weather venues. here are a few... johnny unitis - baltimore; bart starr - green bay; brett favre - green bay; aaron rogers - green bay; terry bradshaw - pittsburgh; jim kelly - buffalo; fran tarkington - minnesota; ken anderson - cincinnati; boomer esiason - cincinnati; bernie kosar - cleveland; john elway - denver; len dawson - kansas city; drew bledsoe - new england; tom brady - new england; phil simms - NYG; eli manning - NYG; joe namath - NYJ; ron jaworski - philidelphia; donovan mcnabb - philidelphia; sonny jurgenson - washington; joe theismann - washington; i can't think of a single instance where any player in the nfl does not want to succeed. it IS the coaches job to see that they are all on the same page and striving to achieve the same goal in a professional manner. that is what he gets paid for. BUT... it is also his job to see that the goal he sets for his players is attainable and reasonable and to put each player, in relation to the whole, in a position he can achieve this goal either physically or mentally. in other words if he doesn't have the player talent to run the system he wants or a key player in that system gets injured he HAS to be able to adjust his scheme/goals to fit the situation. he ALSO has to be able to adjust or revise the scheme he is implementing if it just plain does not work well enough to win or give the team it's BEST chance to win even if he HAS the players to run it. this holds true either during a particular game (game-day adjustments) or the overall way his system works (the cover 2 style of defense in lovie's case) during a season. mentoring or coaching players to transition into the nfl from college and even take existing veterans and improve their mental skills and technique is very important for a coach. i just do not see any significant improvement this coaching staff has done to many, if any, players on this roster over an 8 year period. in many instances i see a regression in their performance if by nothing else than placing them in positions on the field that might not be their best position to play at their highest level. for instance... we play strong safeties at free safety, we play free safeties at strong safety, we transition defensive linemen from tackle to end and back again. on offense we move guards to center, centers to guard, experienced guards on the left to the right and right guards to the left. we move tackles to guard, switch sides that they have experience with and on and on and on. john tait should be the poster boy on this. we took a very good right tackle and paid him a PREMIUM price and moved him to left tackle where he was average to mediocre throughout his career in chicago. next... it is extremely important for a head coach each week to be able to focus his coordinators on not only the other teams strengths and weaknesses but importantly your own and make a gameplan on how to attack your opponent on both sides of the ball. he must understand the game day failings each week and find real solutions to correct them or at the least minimize them. yet we see the same problems crop up week after week in real game situations. in some instances we see it take 2-3 (or more) actual games to adjust to items that should have been in-game adjustments corrected on the fly. with the quality number of players on that team he should have won at LEAST two superbowls. he had HOF, all-pro, pro-bowl players on both sides of the ball in abundance. yet his stubborness, poor coaching and lack of vision squandered maybe the best all around team talent in the history of the modern NFL. if that’s not enough, look at what he did in new orleans. that should say it all. 1. the best coach of all time is not possible for me to determine. it leads back into era’s I know little about and never watched. but… the best ‘head’ coach in the modern era of football to me (as much as I hate to say it) was probably bill walsh. here are some coaches I consider very good to excellent… vince lombardi, john madden, joe gibbs, bill belichick, marv levy, maybe hank stram, tom landry, and (as much as I hate to say it) don shula with the dolphins and certainly NOT with the colts, honerable mention: chuck noll, jimmy johnson, mike shanahan, bill cowher, jeff fisher, bill parcells EDIT: after thinking about it i had to include mike holmgren in this list if you subtract his stint as a GM/coach. he was a very good coach and could put together some excellent coaching personnel under him. of note: george halas. his coaching was mostly before my time although he did win a world championship prior to the superbowl era in 1963. in my opinion he would ‘mostly’ fall into the era prior to the modern NFL era and could be considered maybe the best of all time by others smarter or older than me in that category. 2. “Toub would make a great OC plain and simple” well I guess that is your opinion and you are more than entitled to it. I will just have to strongly disagree as to how anyone without any offensive coaching experience would make a great OC in the NFL. 3. I would “rather have” a new, good, head coach who could help in the choosing of that position along with our new GM. as far as the availability is concerned, if we as a franchise never see the quality in existing coaches to be hired in the marketplace but continue to hire the cheap, never been there or done that type of coaches they will NEVER be available.

a pass oriented offense is “Not a Bears trait”? by that do you mean we should basically be a run oriented team with a strong defense? if so that is the mindset this franchise has had for nearly 50 years and it has failed miserably. yes, you do need good defenses but anyone who believes that multiple superbowl wins will result from a run oriented offense is clearly wrong and especially in this day and age. I understand the cover 2 system does not run this set exclusively (more like 30-40+% of the time). I have gone over this with other posters in the past years in regards to the importance of key defensive players that are needed to make this system work at ALL and in truth we don’t even come close to implimenting it with the talent we have. 1. you need at least one good bump and run cover corner when running the cover 2 and the variations involved. if you don’t believe that then look at the tampa system with their all-pro/pro-bowl caliber CB ronde barber. he was a great cover man right off the LOS whether playing man coverage or running the cover 2. add donnie abraham a one time pro-bowl caliber player and that is pretty good company. compare that to anything we fielded since lovie arrived. bump and run coverage? hell, in our system we play/played our CB’s so far off the LOS it was a free-zone for any qb to get a sure uncontested reception. for whatever reason people believe that you don’t need to be able to cover man in this zone type of scheme which is total nonsense. this is one reason I have been pushing to pick up players like charles woodson a number of years ago and this asumga (sp?) corner more recently. 2. you need at least one very good safety. think of john lynch. since mike brown’s injury riddled final seasons here we haven’t even been close to fielding one and it shows. 3. you need at least ONE killer DT to collapse the pocket with CONSISTANCY and give the qb nowhere to step up. throw in a pretty good tackle in mcfarland EDIT: along with sapp and compare it to what we have fielded since tommy harris started falling apart. 4. you need at least 1 very good DE to rush the passer. rice in tampa fit that bill. we had nothing to compare during lovie’s tenure here before pepperman. 5. linebackers… here we can compare with tampa’s hardy nickerson and derrick brooks. sounds like you need a lot of very good players to make a cover 2 work? the answer is yes. we have never had half of the key players together at one time with the quality to impliment it correcty or efficiently. to top this off the cover 2 system has been figured out for years. it is not a mystery to offensive coordinators around the league yet we continue to draft and acquire players through free agency to run a poor man’s version of this which does not work. huh? players decide their own destiny and coaches coach? what the hell does that mean? lovie is mentoring? in what way? who has lovie made a better player through mentoring? daniel manning a safety who we let go when we are desperate to field one? urlacher and others thinks he connects with the players on some level? who cares? so did jauron. I want someone who can coach players to be better at what they do on the field. whether blasphomy or not, I don’t believe ditka was a good coach so most of what he says I take with a grain of salt. unless you believe the angelo, lovie, martz system should continue every single year you delay just prolongs the inevitable by 1-2 years. lovie and angelo are lame ducks and should have been fired at least 2 years ago. in fact read the post from me to you on feb. 27th 2011: http://www.talkbears.com/forums/index.php?...amp;#entry89366 that pretty much sums up the problems we face for player needs in our near future with the exception of POSSIBLY T gabe carimi, DT paea and FB cluttz (sp?) not even counting the quality depth we surely don’t have. are you serious? you want to make someone our OC who’s ONLY qualification is that he is “innovative” on special teams with absolutely no experience on the offensive side of the ball at all? even as a head coach there is no possible way he will succeed without very good coordinators. final note: I just want to add that some of the reasons for toub’s success in the nfl in chicago is due to an idiot GM who drafts are almost exclusively special team talent at best. add to that he actually aquired some top special team players in free agency like hurd and (can’t think of his name) the linebacker who went I believe to the ravens.

i have to disagree (i know, not a surprise but i have to call em like i see em). a "do-over" is very much needed and before this team again becomes a serious challenger to WIN a superbowl it is going to have to happen. this team IS like the lions of the past and maybe worse whether anyone wants to admit it or not. we need to burn it down and start over from the ashes. an identity crisis does not explain the near complete lack of quality starters and the complete lack of depth at any position. it does not explain the incompetence of a GM and his entire staff which caused this mess by poor drafts for TEN years and his poor choices in coaching hires. it does not explain the poor quality of the coaches that run antiquated systems that are incapable of making not only game-day changes but any serious changes at all on both sides of the ball to be more competetive for EIGHT years. this starts right at the very top of this system where the people, mccaskey's, have almost no understanding of how to run a successful franchise. if they did, would ted phillips have had a job as president of football operations for THIRTEEN years? really??? also to me, ownership is not a "right" or "privilege" whether it be a democracy or not. there are no requirements or standards for whether you will be a good owner of a franchise or not. it is just someone having enough money or luck by birth to buy into a mega corporation called the NFL. lovie smith is an unmarked dead-end road that drops 200 feet off a cliff into a quarry. the best you will ever get out of him is the road we have seen already and to me that isn't even CLOSE to enough. there are no mystery issues of wait a year or even another eight. he has nearly ' 0 ' concept on how to evaluate and adjust an offense. don't you think that is strange even for someone who is defense oriented after eight years? he has played nearly the same defensive scheme since the day he arrived no matter what the personel he is forced to work with when the entire WORLD knows how to beat it and has for a DECADE. we have to be the easiest team in the NFL for the past 6-8 years to game plan against. the cover 2 as we run it with the personel we run it with DOES NOT WORK!! he is stubborn to a fault. if possible he only hires or supports coaches that he worked with before, whether they do a good job or not, and fires the ones that differ from his philosophy or are used as scapegoats to protect his job. do the players like him? probably. but who is running this circus? it's lovie's job to win superbowls, not be every man's best friend. does he need to go now (it should have been 3 years ago at the least)? the answer is YES. there are at least 2 very good coaches on the sidelines that are better coaches by far than what we have. so it's not like just firing one coach without a clue who we could replace him with. if angelo keeps his job for any reason look for a long bare winter for the next 5+ years. quite frankly i don't know what it takes to get fired in this organization (a large guaranteed salary?). it seems the more you fail the more they try to keep you. look at phillips, angelo and lovie. it's a complete catastrophe yet they keep on giving them the support as long as they have to pay out big contracts. as it stands right now we are 3-5 years away from a superbowl WIN if we start a total rebuild right now and actually hire a competent GM and staff and have drafts we can accumulate good players with. this and a GOOD new coaching staff. every year we keep these eunuchs around we are 2 years further than the time it takes to build a good team away from winning a superbowl. on a final note... i hear everyone asking for toub to become either the OC or even HC. why?? he has absolutely no experience at either. other than strength and conditioning coach and special teams coach in the NFL the ONLY coaching experience he has was with university of missouri where he was a defensive line coach for three years. that's it. i don't see how he has even close to enough experience to run an offense as an OC and would need some very good coaching talent under him to run a team if he were HC. kind of like what we have now?

i will agree on firing everybody but i am not so sure about gruden. at one time, in oakland, i liked gruden a lot. but after watching him in tampa i am not so sure. watching him on monday night football has done nothing to temper that feeling that something in his head is rolling around unattached. it's almost like he is trying to live up to the 'chucky' hype that came from oakland. i don't know if it's an act or he IS just crazy. me? i go for jeff fisher or bill cowher and hire a new GM that can actually evaluate the information he gets from scouts to draft real football players. even better, give teddy boy a new job description... mike mccaskey's personal deep massage therapist, and send him packing. i would hire a competent president of football operations and let him hire a GM and put the cowher and fisher suggestions out there for him to choose his coaching staffs from.

first quarter report card on the bears by dan durkin... http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2011/10/05/dur...er-report-card/ i sure can't argue with much of it although i would have liked to see a report card on our coaching staff and front office. but then i guess there is just so much misery you can put in one story.

jeff fisher or cowher would be my choice and also NOT have these guys play the GM role. it just doesn't work 90% of the time and they do a bad job at both. holmgren is the perfect example. 1. fire phillips, get a football minded president of football operations instead of a freakin bean counter. let him find a REAL gm without having to hire some firm to take 6 months to come up with the likes of angelo. give him complete control of the football side of the equation with no say from the dumbest group of owners in professional sports. 2. fire angelo and bring in a real gm and the staff that goes with it that can actually DRAFT football players. 3. fire lovie and company and hire bill cowher or jeff fisher. both have coaching credentials, can put together talented staffs, understand what talent really looks like, and can freaking coach players who have talent to be better players. 4. steal the scouts from the packers by promising them the moon.

ted phillips is the FIRST person that needs to be fired. this is his afterbirth (or in reality mikey's) we have been watching for the last 10 years. then kick angie to the curb like a sack of seeping sewage. where else but mccaskey's chicago does a person who knows virtually nothing about the job he does is made the president of that division for over 10 freaking years and showcases the results we see every week!!!??