Alaskan Grizzly

Many good points in your edit. The Bears may have the better overall receiving corp but with Rodgers throwing and Graham in the mix they have an edge. In the RB department I’m gonna say Howard gives the Bears an edge, however slight. We know what Jordan can do against most teams (close to 100 yards rushing) but will this be the year he adds efficient pass catching to his repertoire? I agree Nagy and Fangio make a potent if not intriguing mix. Mike Pettine has taken over the Packers D and prior to going to the Browns as HC he was putting out some pretty stout defenses. Hard to say how his style will translate to Green Bay’s players but I expect we’ll see some pretty interesting blitz packages (as a side note, many are predicting the Packers in the lead for the Mack lottery - God I hope not). After it’s all said and done I think the lack of game time participation in the preseason our offense will look a little rusty. Our D will be ready (Vic wouldn’t allow any less) but they may be missing a few key pieces; Floyd and Smith. I don’t see a blowout but I don’t see a win for the Bears. Maybe 21-17 or somewhere in that ballpark. *EDIT*: With the recent and surprising acquisition of Mack I’d like to change my score prediction. Packers 0, Bears 150!!! DA BEARZZZ!!!!

You’re right on many points. Yes Trubisky is young. Yes he has very limited experince (especially in this offense and in game time situations). Yes he has a large (although unknown) upside. The Bears are taking a very similar track that the Rams did last year and many of us (myself included) were hoping they would. My doubts lie primarily with Pace and the preparedness of Trub. Pace hasn’t shown he’s as wily as he appears to think he is ... yet. I’m still concerned to see how Robinson and White will perform. Some of his FAs have flamed out and a large potion of his draft picks still are unproven (see Grasu). Yes he’s invested a lot in players in the skill positions and that is great, especially to aid in Trubiskys development and confidence. I’m glad they kept Howard (despite the rumors) and Fangio. Those were two large pieces that succeeded the last two years and would have knocked the Bears back significantly had either or both been lost. Ar this point I think the only way we, as fans, will be able to judge Trubiskys effecticveness will be during the regular season. We can hear all we want to about training camp but until you go against an opponent not running a blase defensive scheme, you won’t really know what you have. From what I see so far in Nagy he looks (for all intents) like he knows what he’s doing. And as long as Trubisky doesn’t go all Cutler like, he should be ok too.

Not for nothing but QBs like Joey Harrington, Vince Young, J’Marcus Russel, David Carr, Matt Leinart and Rick Mirer were all first round draftees that their respective teams invested heavily in. Just because Trubisky was picked at #2 overall (when he could have been picked at 3 by the way) doesn’t gurantee success any more than it guarantees failure. True, Trubisky hasn’t sucked but then he hasn’t been stellar in game situations either. Let’s not overlook his 7-7 (TD to INT ratio) in the pretty vanilla offense from last year. Maybe all this was is an exercise of determining who the backup QB will be as they potentially keep only 2 QBs on the final 53. Still, it would have been nice to see Trubisky get some more in-game experience.

Yep. And for me, hearing and seeing are two separate things. And for the record I don’t think Daniel is a stud. He definitely looked like garbage in that first outing. But I believe he has benefited from both game action; althougbeit preseason and familiarity with this style offense in KC.

Yes that one throw that Trubisky made was pretty nice. But that was also a pretty sweet catch that Miller made, that one time. Cutler was pretty good at occasionally throwing sweet passes too. Daniels also made some pretty nice timing drops to Wims. I mean you gotta admit that TD pass to back corner of the endzone was pretty sweet. And yes I agree we could argue the point of who is better at what for however long. Do I honestly think there is a QB controversy per se? not completely. I’m hoping that Nagy isn’t concerned with how Trubisky has performed thus far and is covering up by “resting his starters”. I’m one that would have liked to see Trubisky play more actual game time snaps than just a few and only at practice. Given all the considerations I listed before it’s enough for a lowly casual fan such as myself to want. But if Nagys good with it, then by golly he’s the one making the big bucks to make those decisions. I’ll be looking forward to the game with GB to allay those concerns.

What have you seen that convinces you that Trubisky has the job locked down? Considering the situation our team is in; first year coach with a new system and all it makes more sense than not to see our starters get more ‘game time’ experience or at least as much as experience as possible as we fast approach the new season. It’s not just this game that Trubisky didn’t play in but most of the others this preseason too. And of those times he played, he looked just ok. Yes he started last year but that was a completely different system with a completely different coaching group. I think it was Colin Cowherd that said he can’t put a grade on Trubisky because he “doesn’t trust him”. I’d say that’s a fair assumption based on his limited college experience, his mediocre performance last year and his next to nothing play so far in this preseason. Nagy is an understudy of Reid’s who is known to deploy unorthadox moves in the pre and post seasons. So maybe that’s all this is. And I like Nagy a lot. It’s just that once the season starts and if the team (Trubisky) struggles out of the gate, fans are going to start questioning both Trubisky and Nagy after what we’ve seen so far with this new team.

Said it once, I’ll say it again; love me some Wims!!! I dare say he so far has looked better than Miller. Of course our “#2 QB” was the one throwing some nice drops to him. Which makes me want to bring up a bigger concern. Why hasn’t Trubisky played more snaps? He hasn’t proven at all that he’s ready for the regular season. The one game he played into had him with one TD and one turnover where Daniel turned in a 2 TD effort. I dare also say we may be looking at a QB controversy early into this season? I was hard on Daniel early on but so far he’s looks better at running the offense in game time situations.

If JPP can play with 1-2 missing fingers I’d think Floyd should be able to man up and use a club cast too. The pragmatist in me says before I buy off on this offense and how effective it is, I’d like to see more production against 1st string defenses. Trubiksys performance was ok and the TD throw to Burton although impressive in scheme was countered by the INT due to the aforementioned confusion of Cohen. Chase Daniel looked better in his play; althoughbeit against a lesser quality D. And Mizzel (whoever the hell he is) looked as impressive (if not more) as Miller.

Realistically speaking what's to say Wims couldn't supplant a 2nd or 3rd seeded WR on the team? Speaking as of 'right now' we don't know how well Robinson or White are going to do based on injury history alone. Yes there is no doubt Robinson has shown he can perform in the NFL at an elite level (he did it for one season after all) but he's coming off a pretty significant injury on a body part that is a necessity in his position. White has not only been injured in each of his first three years but each year its a new injury; 2015 - left tibia, 2016 - left fibula and 2017 - left shoulder blade. That being said, he has yet to prove his 1st round grading. And because I'm not as high on Miller as others, what's to say Wims couldn't be better? How do the two compare in college? The only advantage that I see Miller having was he played 1-2 years more in D1 than did Wims? But an argument could be made that not only did Wims play only one year at the D1 level, he played in the SEC. Many would agree that in that division you are more likely to see NFL ready defensive players (let alone teams) than any other. As far as measurables; both were invited to the Combine but only Wims produced (I didn't look to see why Miller didn't measure at the combine). Miller did have his own pro-day in April so here are the 'comps' based on that. Wims: 6'3"/215, 40 yard dash - 4.53, vertical jump - 33.5". Miller: 5'11"/201, 40 yard dash - 4.50, vertical jump - 39". So Miller has more collegiate D1 experience. Wims is taller and heavier (explains the lack of speed?), yet both ran a near identical 4.5 ish 40. Miller does have a little more height in his vertical with nearly being able to leap a full half foot more than Wims. At the end though NFL.com graded them pretty close at 5.79 for Miller and 5.28 for Wims (on a scale of 1-10). For the sake of contrast, another fave of mine Calvin Ridley received a grade of 6.4.

I only saw a very small piece of the game and what I did see was...well not so good, especially on offense. That was due in large part to the Chase Daniels performance. Wasn’t he brought to Chicago to join Nagy due to his familiarity with this type offense? Yes he threw two interceptions and perhaps they were due in large part of the performance of others but many of his other throws (that I did see) were relative garbage. Makes some sense why Helfrich said earlier this week: “We’re nowhere-nowhere-near where we need to be.” Im stoked to see Wyms’ stat line and see what Ashkum had to say about him. He’s a personal favorite of mine and would almost venture a guess that he’s going to surprise a lot of people; maybe even pass up a few others on the team. And Cunnigham continues to impress. He’s an older version of what Cohen hopes to be someday. ? Fitts and Irving looked good in the bit that I saw them. Of those two, maybe the alter pass rusher to Floyd can be found?

Curious why you don’t think Amos could or will be a ‘core player’? Seems rather early to say that. Granted his 2016 was not so great but he showed vast improvement despite not starting last year. And in Fangios defensive scheme it is said he prefers ‘in the box’ capable SS which I think Amos has shown he is willing to do. Also agree that we shouldn’t be leading the way in salary cap space but not sure you can buy a core player from somewhere else.

Yep, have to drop out tho year. Thanks for the opportunity to play along these last few years. And Sulster...all my best to a continued recovery.

Classy move Mr. Cohen. Taking a nod from Warrick Dunn, JJ Watt and other notable NFL stars giving back to the community. Great way to turn the tide from some of the other silliness (and plain idiocy) that seems to dominate the NFL headlines some days. Glad he's doing it and is a Bear.

And you claim to be a student of Freud. Perhaps I’ve given you too much credit. You continue to twist what I’m saying to fit your narrative. Please take some time and look up ‘critical thinking’ when you get a moment. I know you are capable of finding definitions as you so cleverly demonstrated . Frankly I suppose I could care less that you think I’m negative. If it soothes you to think so; great for you. As far as the team goes I’m enthusiastic about a lot of the changes made and hopeful they will work out as planned. I like Nagy. Think he’s got what it takes to coach. Like a lot of the players on the team, despite some of the uncertainties I see. We will all see how successful he is in orchestrating wins with the group he currently has. At this point we’ve wasted too much time on the personal banter and one-upmanship so I’m moving on.

Funny how you 'preach' about my reading comprehension (or lack thereof) then took the liberty to assume that by my saying both Robinson and Watkins getting big money meant they were "good" players (as if that was a negative). Yet I didn't say that at all. It is noteworthy however that Adam thought that Robinson potentially could be a good player because he was paid big money and a "top free agent" prospect. You constantly contort my critical thinking style into 'negative attitude' because my opinion differs than yours. As I've said over the years I can't help that you're super sensitive to your opinion being the one that is right...all the time. I'm simply questioning how we can measure this year's players on the roster to players on the Rams from last year. Forgive me for using prior (and established) statistics from which to measure. Some of our players haven't played a full season in a few years (White and the aforementioned Robinson). Others have done 'acceptable' (but not mind-blowing) with proven and explosive offenses (Burton and Gabriel). Where others haven't even played an NFL down yet (Miller). I personally find it tricky (if not risky) to say that these players will do better than what LA had on its roster last year; or even this year for that matter. As I've repeated time and again, I don't WISH at all for our team to fail. I just have a different take on it than you. That's all there is to it. And although we do have some crows in Alaska; Ravens are the predominant bird of that family. Both in numbers and size.

I figured. But still in the case of Robinson, Miller, Gabriel and Cohen (and maybe even Trub); questions still remain. What are you basing your measurements on?

At the risk of being dubbed a 'Debbie downer' I'll go the devil's advocate route and challenge some of these options. For one they added Brandin Cooks to their arsenal this year. And whether he ends up being their #1 WR all he's managed to do is get 1173yds / 8 TDs two seasons ago and 1082 / 7TDs last year. Our guy; Robinson, hasn't had a complete season since 2015 where he got over 1000 yards. To be frank, I'm concerned with how he'll pan out. I've got to believe with all the money paid, he's going to do well. Cooper Kupp (in his first year) got 869 yards and 5 TDs with the Rams last year. Similar to how Stinger thinks Cohen is immeasurable for us, who do we put against Kupp? The best we have is maybe Gabriel who only got 378 yds and 1 TD last year with ATL after going 579 yds the year before. (By the way, this was the same offense (ATL - Ryan) that made Hester look like a respectable receiver). Comparing our #1 TE's? I'm guessing theirs will be Everett (who was a 2nd round pick last year) who got 244 yds with 2 TDs. While with PHI last year, Burton put up 248 yds and 5TDs. Shaheen (himself a 2nd round pick last year) got 127 yds and 2 TDs. Isn't Miller pretty much done or is he still planning on making a comeback? Watkins went to KC on a mega-deal and Woods ended up with 781 yds and 5 TDS after his first year in LA. Our comp maybe is White....who is still TBD. Mostly because I'm still not a believer in Pace, I'm skeptical in how most of 'our' players will pan out. But because I like Nagy...I trust he'll get the best he can out of them.

Actually not. Trubisky did fill in for previous starter Marquise Williams on occasion before getting his own actual designation as starter in 2016. So those other 18 games were in relief efforts for Williams. And, oddly enough, Trubisky didn’t fare all that horribly in relief. Found this article (below) that helps answer some of the questions skeptics like me have/had about Trubiskys potential. https://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2017/04/why_did_mitchell_trubisky_only.html Its kinda the reverse issue that Alabama currently has with Tagavailoa and Hurts.

"Last year MT had 2193 yards- 7 tds-7 int. Ran for 248 yards and 2 tds. (in 2016 Jared Goff 1093 yards-5 tds-7 ints ran for 16 yards and 1 td)" The one glaring difference between the two (besides the 12 vs 7 starts) are the yardage. Otherwise the TD/Int ratio is pretty similar as is the completion rate (Goff 54.6% Trub 59.4%). The stats can be viewed in two ways. One being the way you're reading them which by the raw numbers show Trubisky played more games than did Goff his first year. However, between the two they were pretty 'apples to apples' in most other statistics. Interestingly enough, in their college careers Goff played 37 games and produced 12,195 yards (7.8 yd avg) through the air with 96 TDs and 30 INTs where Trubisky played in 31 games where he threw for 4,762 yards (8.3 yds avg) with 41 TDs and 10 INTs. The efficiency rating weighed a bit more in Trubisky's favor during that time although Trubisky only had 13 actual 'starts' where Goff pretty much started all the games he played in.

I’m curious how you can say: “MT is ahead of Goff in his second year.” Is it based solely on Trubisky vs Goff or who they have around them?

After they made a try at getting Vic over as their new DC (upon the departure of Capers) they instead grabbed Mike Pettine. He’s heralded as a decent DC who like Fangio, gets his defenses playing in the top 10. I’m guessing he saw a need for more pass protection with having to see Stafford and Cousins twice a year. Hopefully Trubisky will give him fits too.

According to Belichik they didn’t know about it in NE either. Two avenues of thought here. Court of law and court of public opinion. Due process has been played out with the court of law. I am personally troubled that a Grand Jury originally decided on a true bill of assault back when this started. But apparently due to the victim’s unwillingness to testify the prosecuting attorneys office at the time chose not to go through a trial. From what it sounds the statute of limitations has run its course and any new charges are essentially moot. It should be noted that ‘due process’ would have also allowed Patricia to defend himself against any allegations at the time. But due to their not being any trial, he couldn’t and didn’t have to. Probably why both the Patriots and Lions were not aware; no public record of it for background investigators to ‘discover’. Now that this has resurfaced he will have to answer to it in the court of public opinion. And because of that the Lions will have to make a descion on what they do next.

You’re right. I meant to compare Cohen more to Tyreek Hill not Hunt. Although listed as a WR he gets a fair amount of touches from the backfield. I had my ‘H’ - backs mixed up. Although your case for Hunt is more in line with how similar he is with Howard. Thus dismissing, or at least diminishing the nay-sayers on whether Howard would work in Nagys offense.

Agreed. (Wish there was a way to ‘like’ comments on this new format.) I would hope that Trubisky does exactly as you suggest. The WCO with some zone runs thrown in for Howard will make things a bit less likely for Trubisky to fail. Should be fun to watch.

You’re suggesting I watch highlight film on each player? Thought you weren’t a supporter of that. And for the record I didn’t necessarily relate to stats but instead measured results in comparable skill tests. Will Cohen have special moments? Probably. Will he be the most special player on the team? Doubtful.