Alaskan Grizzly

In my defense, and not to be simply argumentative, I didn't start the comparison to Brady. It was presented as a comparison and I used it to illustrate why, in my opinion, it wasn't a fair comparison...not taken wholly. And rather I chose to compare specific aspects....or "elements".

Here it is, plain and simple. What was Michael Bush brought to Chicago for? And why? Then ask yourself, what has he done well at since coming to the team? That is the comparison I'm making. I realize that historically Brady has done it better for longer, and in no way am I comparing the two in overall skill set. Just that when it comes to making short yardage gains, Bush can hold his own. Don't read into it too much.

It wouldn't matter, I don't think, if Lovie got the team to the NFC championship game (like he did a few years ago) at this point. Hell I'm not even sure that it would matter if he got the team to the Super Bowl...like he did a few years ago. I'm not even convinced it would matter if the team won the Super Bowl. Most would want him gone. Reminds me a lot of folks in NY when they wanted Coughlin gone a few times, but fortunately for them he didn't. Frankly this talk of wishing for Lovie to go has gotten old. Almost each and every year of his tenure its been this way. I sense Wesson feels similar frustration and I am more of the opinion that the TEAM will do what it is capable of. They will realize that they have nowhere to go but down and will do what they can to win. At this point, I think if they display a lackluster performance....despite all the injuries...that would be more telling of who will be leading the team next year than anything. At this point all the TEAM needs is an invite to the playoffs to prove the detractors wrong.

And you can safely say that because the 4th and short attempt did not succeed. Had it succeeded, would we be having this discussion? And as I've asked, had Robbie kicked the FG and missed, would we be collectively asking why didn't we just run it? We have Michael Bush explicitly for times like that. The odds that Robbie missing a FG can simply be equated to Bush not making a short yard gain. The point you bring up about "scoring points after the conversion" after the fact is interesting because, if I understand correctly, the odds are even better. Should the team still not be able to convert another series of downs, they are that much closer to the end of the field and can try to do the FG. Let me ask this, what if during that original fourth and short play Toub went to Lovie (or however that works) and said "remember that trick play we did a few weeks ago with Podlesh? Maybe we should try that again." And the end goal was to just get the yardage, and it worked? Would people be ok with it? What if it didn't work? Something tells me we'd be having a similar discussion. With regards to having a player like Brady for the Patriots, with his history and success and converting 4th down plays. I can simply retort with (as I said before) we DO have a player like Brady in Bush....who usually succeeds in short yardage plays. And as I've said before, he didn't...this time.

"4-Robbie Gould is 21-25 for the year and fairly automatic from 32 yards" 4 misses are 4 misses. And "fairly automatic" is not completely automatic. (Gould did miss one in the 30-39 range just against Minn and made 5/7 this year in that category). And just for reference, there are places up here where the sun doesn't rise some days. Especially this time of year. Bush has not averaged less than 1.6 yds a carry this year. That was more than enough for him to convert the 4th. It just didnt happen...this time.

I have to say "X2" to this. The advocate in me says "what if" Gould had missed? People would have asked why didnt the team run it? It was that close to being a first down. In my mind, the statistics of not making it vs making it were equal when comparing Gould making it and Bush making the short yards. It just so happens that Bush didn't. so its easier to ask..."why didn't we kick the FG"? The momentum could have been monumentally stronger had Bush made that run. It would have reinforced the O-line confidence. Of which we know is under heavy scrutiny. And with that successful run, the team probably (not suredly) would have eventually gotten a TD.

With Manning, he pretty much does what he wants. Pretty sure that Fox lets him do as he sees needed. And I think you're right that Cutler could adapt. He is a smart kid. And really all that would happen is Toub could add more trickery to the playbook. Sort of like how Washington was doing with NYG last night.

Baltimore is feeling the same way we are. I think the team can still eek out more production of a few players; Tillman, Briggs and Peppers...but not much. Obviously Urlacher's loss is probably the most noticeable. Especially given the intangibles he provides when he is playing.

So maybe now is a good time to try SMC at LB?

I have to say that having someone like Toub doing that isnt a half bad idea. Toub has been with the staff for a number of years and knows the idiosyncrasies involved. And I believe at one time the upper management considered him as interim HC should Lovie have left a few years ago. The downside is I'm not all that keen on having another coordinator for Jay. That would be four in five (?) years. Jason: Ouch! 1999-2000 (Crowton's tenure as OC). That was definitely a forgettable time. Combined 11-21 record (?) and no higher score than 27 in a game both years? No wonder I don't remember him. And Martz' issue was more his ego. He would not change and when told to, he was slow about it. Maybe it would be beneficial if Tice at least took advice from Toub?

You know watching last nights game (Was vs NYG) reminded me a lot of the Bears / Sea game. The one exception in how NY has their DL set up. What they call the NASCAR package. And despite that, RGIII still had a field day.

Totally understand. Many folks thought that now Cutler has what he needs in WR, this would be an overly exciting year. But I'm one who doesn't like all the hoopla associated with predictions of bliss. Hence why I'm not a fan of power rankings. Ask Atlanta what it's like to "rule the roost" in the regular season, only to stink it up in the playoffs. Or even SF for last year for that matter. If the Bears make the playoffs, I wouldn't necessarily write them off. They have a good number of players that have been there before. Trouble is, will who the team needs be there? Like you said, injuries are indeed beginning to mount. And Cutler is one scramble away from being out again. (anyone else cringe on the slider and forward dive he took on a couple plays?).

Of course, since I'm still a member of the Lovie bandwagon I'll add this... Bears vs Colts: 41-21; Bears vs Rams (who beat SF by the way - think someone figured out Kaepernick): 23-6; Bears vs Cowboys: 34-18 (in Dallas I might add); Bears vs Jags: 41-3; The aforementioned Bears vs Titans: 51-20; and just last week 28-10 over Minnesota. I don't think these scores indicate letting anyone "stay around". That being said, my optimism is waning. Just a little. My thought is simply, (and referring to the footnote of my posts) the team will produce what it is capable of doing. Will Lovie take the "blame" he professed yesterday to heart? Will the team react in kind? These remaining games will be telling. If they win more than lose it will be interesting. If not....

I think "TD"s comment above may have struck accord with me. That being with the team not being able to score, especially as of late, taking them when you can is much more prudent. Next 4th and inches, go for the FG. But to address one part of your above reply. In regards to Fortes inability to run between the tackles: it looks as though Bush does it allright. He isn't a finesse runner and seems to be able to go "North/South" more so than does Forte. Although in yesterday's game, Forte was able to do better late in the game.

I just have to say, the 4th and short...that end of the field. You almost always have to try. The fans wanted it, heck most of us did I would bet. 9 times out of ten Bush converts those. Had he converted, would we be praising the coaches? Had the team instead kicked the FG, how many here would have asked "what if" and perhaps been upset that they hadn't? "Hindsight is always 20/20". Things that killed the team today (just to name a few); no Jeffery, injuries are mounting, Fortes inability to run between the Tackles, Bennets drop (I swear at least one receiver has done that the last few weeks), and the Defense really showed its age. Like the announcer (Tim Ryan) said, that last drive (of Seattle) before the end of regulation, really sapped their strength. They have been playing at a high level all season it was only a matter of time.

So in this article they point out how Carimi could be masked by playing in the interior. However he could be exploited by his size by the likes of Raji and Wilfork. My question, how does that translate if he is used in pulling situations? What about the thougt of an RB running behind a guard who is 6'7" and shields his view from defenders? Or how does it matter if he has a center on one side and a tackle on the other where he can try to deflect his opponent? I realize he might have more issues with this as that was some of the problems he exhibited while at tackle. Bottom line, I agree that he needs to be given more time. He's recovering from a pretty good injury and doesn't appear to have completely recovered just yet.

Dont get me wrong, I too think that neither is doing all that particularly well...as initially hoped. But of the two I would be interested in seeing eacho backs YPC as it just looks like Bush gets more when he runs. And I would expect Forte's overall yardage to be higher given he is the "feature back". What I think is hurting him, besides the slow reaction to North/South running (and what you mentioned) is they aren't running pass plays to him as much. That is one of his stronger (sorry for the pun) fortes.

"One man's garbage is another man's treasure" . I'm thinking (hoping) Gurode is one of those players for the Bears. Not the Orlando Pace version that didn't work out. And, as I said before I feel that Scott will pan out better than expected. He has had time as a starter with the Steelers, so there is that. Now the other side of the discussion is about drafting. You're aware of my stance and going with my original remark of "garbage" vs "treasure" I'm just leery when you see players like Colombo (in this case our garbage, someone else's treasure) and Williams - and maybe Carimi (who were high draft picks) not work out, then I tend to look towards the FA avenue. But like I said, hoping that the draft will work out.

Looks like 2005 (according to Wikipedia - below). Bill Parcells thougth he (Gurode) would be better at Guard...then realized the errors of his ways. Hmmmm...this could prove to be an issue. Perhaps Garza could go back to Guard? The one memory that sticks out about Gurode was when Albert Haynesworth stomped his head. Hopefully it won't recur with a meeting of Suh. He likes to do crap like that. I'm a fan of this type of move (signing proven veteran OLmen). But unfortunately at the expense of Okoye. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andre_Gurode

If I may, I don't see Matty's loss being all that influentianal. He really hasn't done much. With the line work and his slow attacking the holes, he has just appeared avearge so far. We were just discussing how the loss of Clutts makes a world of difference for Forte. At least it appears that way. Beyond that, Matt might benefit from having more short passes thrown his way. ??? But currently, of the two, Bush looks to be having a better season....overall.

I venture into this with some trepidation...but here goes. I think what GrizzlyBear was saying, all things considered, its not a bad line. It could be worse...Orlando Pace (the retreaded version), Levi Horn (?), John St Clair (not even good in the original form, let alone re-treaded) and Omiyale to name a few "experiments" that didn't work out. And for the record, I looked at the lineup for the 2006 season (when the Bears last went to the Super Bowl) three of the 5 linemen then were FA acquisitions; Ruben Brown, Tait and Fred Miller. (Yes I know two of them were former 1st rounders, but picked by someone else). Anyhow, getting back to what Grizz was addressing. Given where the Bears find themselves currently (and after losing two linemen in last weeks game, and another for his "own reasons") they are making do with what they have. Who knows, with Carimi at Guard maybe he will do better there? He certainly doesn't appear to be a Tackle right now...not with his technique and physique. Garza is getting long in tooth, but still a veteran. Webb...well there are too many issues to address but until he matures we may never see his full potential. And for what its worth he was paired up with Jared Allen last week...and held his own. To be fair, Scott isn't really a "nobody". He did start several games for the Steelers and aside from a few glitches in last weeks game, didn't look all that bad. And Louis could prove worth keeping, despite his bad injury. Does the team sign him to a multi-year contract? Probably not. But given all this (and the ongoing issues the last few years) it is pretty evident the team needs to address the OLine. If for nothing else the reasons of what has transpired the last week and a half. How do they do it? Well that is where you and I differ. But I have conceded before that if the right OLman was available at #1 (weighted with everything else) then do it. I just don't want to be having another Carimi / Williams discussion this time next year.

Cool article. That was by far one of the more amazing plays I've seen in awhile. I couldnt believe Spaeth caught it. On the actual running of the play, I couldn't even see him then *bam* ( John Maddenism) he's in the endzone. What was funny after the play, I think, commentator "Moose" Johnston said something to the effect of Spaeth amazingly caught that when he can barely catch the easier ones thrown his way. No doubt! Good solid game yesterday. Too bad about all the injuries though. We'll see how the team adapts.

Indeed. Welcome back to first place Chicago. Was watching the game while at the gym and the wife couldn't understand why I was cheering...until she saw who the Giants were playing. Then she understood. She caught a glimpse of Matthews on the sideline and asked "what's wrong with that long haired a-hole"? "I dont like that guy.". My wife's a good woman.

Think I heard about another player having the same problem. That being hurt last year enough to where that player couldn't really work out in the offseason enough to be where they should be for game shape. This I think is what is going on with Carimi. He seems smaller and weaker than the beginning of last year before he was injured. With his current size he looks more suited to being a Guard. I think all he needs is some more time to get some meat back on his bones and he'll look and play more like we are expecting. We may not see it this year but should by the beginning of next year. That being said maybe getting some time as a guard will be good for his development.

Maybe Carolina would be willing to give him back? Agreed that I am glad it worked out the way it did. But still wish he (Olsen) was on the team.