Mongo3451

I haven't agreed with the fire Turner comments untill this season. There has been one thought I had that was the deal breaker for me. For the length of time Turner has been our OC, what is our "bread and butter" plays? Don't all good teams have them? Don't all good OC's establish them? That's the rub with me.

I'll have to disagree about putting the microscope on the players. When you get beat like that, it starts at the top. I agree that pro's should be pro's, but we also have to understand that we are dealing with young men who can be inspired by great leadership and most importantly a great battle plan.

We are pretty much in agreeance on this one. I think we all clamored for various upgrade scenarios before Pace and Shaffer were signed. I think what we got were leftovers. My main mistake was buying the Pace hype that the staff and media put out. They showed that he had good stats in the passing game last year, but as the saying goes, "The greatest lie of all is the truth cleverly told." We decided quantity was more important than quality. Unfortunately, it has yet to payoff.

Thank God for the sanity!

You know what pisses me off the most, is that they had the money to sign better players(OL in particular) and passed OL again in the draft. I was very happy with the Pace, Omiyale and Shaffer signings, but didn't have the scouting intell our staff was privy to.(which I guess was shit)

I'm not going to disagree on whether Url has value or not, because he does. His level of value is what I disagree on. It's not the MLB that makes the cover-2 work. Url just masked some of the weaknesses. The weakness in personnel is up front. They are the ones failing. The reason Url's skillset is missed is because the safeties have to play so far back due to the DL not getting it done. That's why the huge hole is in the middle of the field. Add to that, Afalava is not known for coverage skills and Manning lacks instincts. Heck the only MLB I can name that played the cover-2 is Urlacher. The weakness in the system is that it requires pressure from the front 4 to be successful. For a few years now, we have not had that pass rush and have payed dearly. Looks like we are exposed again, as Marinelli has not helped much. Top notch QB's also seem to tear up the cover two if they have a balanced attack. Problem is, there are more good QB's out there than at anytime I can remember. The 46 was great, but it is no longer a staple because it was exposed and also required the perfect personnel cocktail. The cover-two is in the same boat and "jumped the shark" a few years ago in Chicago.

Time for Harris to go. I don't care if it's by trade or cut.

Agreed on Hiestand and Beekman. Place Beekman back at LG and let him settle in for a couple weeks, then re-assess the situation. If his presence starts to make a difference, the rest of the OL can be evaluated. Right now, we don't know if Pace can play or not because of how bad Omiyale is. If Pace proves to be done, I'd insert Schaffer at RT and move Williams to LT so we can assess needs for next year.

Maybe this has something to do with it... For the limited action Wolfe gets he's responsible for 20% of the sacks given up. Liability or not, Turner could have Wolfe chip and flair out into a pattern instead of relying on him to make a block.(turn a weakness into a strength) Then the D would maybe have to slow that blitzer down to keep Wolfe in check????

They played it just like they wanted. Cutler will be 30 and in the prime of his career when he's up for re-negotiation. Wait till you see that deal.

I'm at the point that I want the entire offensive staff fired. Since I want them all gone, I'd give them the season to finish and announce their dismissal the next day. Miracles happen, but I just don't see the progress.

I'm with the crowd weilding the torches and pitchforks. Omiyale is really really bad. On the most routine blocks he seems to lack the ability to even get his body between the defender and the ball. Horrible footwork and horrible intensity. I would go as far to say the guy is a complete pussy. Huuuge gaffe in signing this guy. Beekman should be starting this Sunday. If not, I'll begin losing faith in our staff. I'm already beginning to use hindsight in viewing the people we had the money to sign VS who we ended up with.

Thanks for update Jason. I have a few questions. 1) Did the recievers seem to get separation? I have been concerned about the lack of passing plays mid to deep and can't really out my finger on it from the TV view. Cutler seems to rarley pass in rhythm and seems to make plays when he sees a player open and just fires. Is it separation, OL, Cutler, play calling? 2) OL?? Do they suck that bad or is Turner/Cutler not able to make hot reads and adjustments? OL part II - Do they ever get any push? It has seemed non-existent. 3) Roach seems to be a stud against the run and liability in the passing game. Is he reacting late or just out of place in passing situations. Reacting late can be due to experience, but out of place is inexcusable. IMO - we lost a very winnable game against a good football team in their house. I expected a different type of game from both teams, but definately expected more from our O coming off a bye week.

I was huge Benson supporter, as I thought as most experts stated; that he was the most NFL ready back to come out of college when he was drafted. Lo and behold, we were wrong. He wasn't ready. He wasn't ready to grow up. He wasn't ready to train. He definately wasn't ready to be a professional. In reading an article last night, I found what I believe is the truth. Here's the rub for me "People who know him insist he changed after his release and that the Bears got his attention by firing him. But it was other clubs passing on him, they say, that really shook him up. In fact, it was nearly four months before he landed a job, and then only because Cincinnati was running out of healthy backs." http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/12352707 I think most of us truly believe he never got it here. Whether it was the coaches not getting to him or him not getting tp himself. the ultimate responsibility was his. He simply did not do it. I'll go as far to say it was Benson on his appearance alone. Look at him as a Bear and he looked soft. Look at him now and he looks chisled. It shows he's actually working for his paycheck. If I have to guess, we are going to see his demands in the offseason. I am a fan of Benson's ability and running style, but I'll have a hard time forgetting what he cost us. In a nutshell, I couldn't disagree more.

Impressive accomplishment: Smith registered his 50th victory in his 88th game as Bears coach Sunday (including playoffs), reaching the milestone quicker than Bill Parcells (89th game), Bill Walsh (91st), Chuck Noll (94th), Bill Belichick (111th) and Tom Landry (119th). http://www.chicagobears.com/news/NewsStory.asp?story_id=6177

I matters about as much as your reply.

This team is a slow starter. I hope as well, we can come out of the gate firing. Like AZ said though, at we're making adjustments. I especially like they had a specific mission for Tillman on Johnson in the 2nd half. It seemed to pay off.

I loved seeing it and pray he's judicious from here on out. (meaning only if necessary)

LOL

LOL

Thanks for posting that. Was going to do the same. Agreed with all the Defensive personnel grades, but think think the staff gets a B to B+. On the offensive side the OL has moved from an F to a D- for me. They usually need time to gel, but that is not being factored in my grade. Agreed on Turner. Toub gets a B for his unit getting gashed on coverage breakdowns. Lovie gets a B+. I'm glad he has taken accountability and making others accountable. Looking for Harris and Harrison to come to life. If they do, all other fascets of the D will improve.

Really? Stupid? I would like to hear from one person on this board who would not choose to be an NFL coach if given the opportunity. The reason I say that is because I believe people in general seek their own level in life. I don't know coach Barta and am not going to look him up. But, he either has a life calling to be a high school coach or could not cut it in the NFL. Either way, he is not a poster on this board and he obviously made his choice in life. You or any other poster does not have that choice. Take Shoop out of the analogy and this argument is retarded. (Shoop joke) Honestly, I totally don't buy it at all. I would have the time of my life and would eat, breath and sleep the job. But, simply feel I would always feel over my head. This is something you have to be in for life. If I'm a minority on this issue. So be it.

Not true and furthermore you are embellishing on my statement to enhance your argument. And if I wanted to call any indivual out, I would do so. I think everyone knows that. We all can be upset about calls and think there are better candidates for the OC job out there. But to come in with the arrogance that we (as in anyone on this board) could do better is pure bullcrap. We may get a play or two right, but not on the level of any NFL OC. I know you meant Wolfe and I agree with that assessment. I even cussed at the TV when the play was ran. He admitted the mistake. Do you that as a sign of weakness? You are right on your assessment of OC and GM. I truly believe no-one on this board could succeed as an OC. But, I do think some of us could handle a draft with the right personnel. Some could manage the cap with support staff. But none of us could be the complete package for any coaching, scouting or GM position in the NFL. Again, through your enhancement of my post, you try to say we can't have an opinion. That's why we are all here. That's almost offensive. The Wolfe / Hester analogy was to show that you have to earn respect to soften the defense. IF Wolfe is viewed as a perimiter player only, he will be defensed that way. Thus a non factor in any situation. Once he busts a big gain up the middle, the rest will open up for him.

I've been reading all the posts on this topic and have some observations. 1st, I thought it was refreshing for Turner to come out and say he messed. To me, him admitting the mistake shows he's human and willing to look himself in the mirror. 2nd, in defense of Turner. Unless you work for an NFL franchise as a coach, you don't know more about delivering "High quality H2O" than this guy, let alone being an OC. Am I saying shut up and don't criticize him? Hell no. But don't act like he's an idiot and you know more. It just takes from individual credibilty. Lastly, while I hate seeing Wolfe getting stuffed, I do understand the concept. If Wolfe breaks just one run from the inside, it changes the gameplan forever when he comes in the game. (the whole playbook is opened for hom now and he becomes a true weapon) It's kinda like using Hester on the WR screen and reverses last year. They never worked. Now they do.

Adams - I have always liked him, but I just question how much the staff does. If Dusty didn't go down w/ injury, and Harrison didn't show up to camp out of shape, would Adams even be starting? Even if the staff has come to appreciate him more, how much will be tested before the 2 year period I mentioned as we will have to re-sign him. I am just not confident the staff will want to re-sign him. They simply do not care for DTs that can't rush the passer. I really see no need to let him walk, unless through normal attrition. Harrison may well still be around, but I see that as far from a lock. He showed "something" on a few occasions last year, but didn't exactly break out. This year, he showed up to camp over weight and out of shape, and his work ethic came into question, prompting the staff to sit him until he got his weight down. Thus far, through only three games I realize, he has shown nothing. There is still time, but I just am not so confident he sticks long term. You are going on pure speculation that he will not grow up and be a professional. Anderson - He is a FA after this season, and (a) needs to show a lot for us to even think about re-signing him and ( even if he does show something, he could then position himself for a nice paycheck. Will we pay him? We should pay him if he’s a capable DE. They simply don’t grow on trees and we can’t get rid of this many players and replace them via the draft. Briggs w/o question. The rest? Yes, to most of them. We can’t afford to lose most of them over the next 2 years. The loss of depth alone would be disastrous. Williams is a FA after this season, and I frankly would be surprised if he re-signed. He has been stuck behind Briggs, and not until this season did we even give him an opportunity, short as it was, at a position other than WLB. Even now, w/ the injuries to Urlacher and Pisa, Williams seems like an after thought. I can easily see him looking to move on to a team where he may believe he has a better chance to play. If someone leaves to be a starter, I’m good with that. Otherwise, keep Williams. Pisa - Could very well happen, but lets be honest for a moment. As great as he looked in camp, he has yet to do jack in the regular season. Before we declare him a long term starter, he needs to start a regular season game. He has been a good player for several years. I think he has a place for a few more. Raoch - He may well be here, but I simply am not a big fan. Roach actually impressed me with good instincts at MLB. I like the guy. Tillman to FS has always been a message board topic, and fans seem to love the idea, but the staff has never gone for it. That still doesn’t mean it shouldn’t happen or that it’s not a feasible idea. The argument is that he is our best CB. I see him getting beat like a drum, then making up for it with sure tackling and stripping. That sounds more like a FS than a CB. I am a big fan of Graham, but is the staff? Even when both Tillman and Bowman were hurt in preseason, the staff went w/ McBride, who was cut, over Graham. Graham is a mystery to me. He did pretty darn well last year, but the entire offseason, the staff simply has not seemed inclined to get him on the field. When Bowman was knocked out of the game for a short bit, it was Vasher who came in. That is the same Vasher who has stunk, and who has little future w/ the team. If Graham is in the plans at all, you sure could have fooled me. Maybe Graham is in the doghouse. I like him as well. He’s gotta be in the plans. You always see turnover. But as I look at the roster, I see far more than just some turnover. I see a total overhaul. Often you see a couple players per unit change over the period of a couple years, but I see the opposite. I see only a couple remaining over the next two years, and if that is the case, it would be an overhaul, not a tweak. You do realize that we already have 4 new starters on D this year? Two more years of that trend and nobody is left. Changes happen all the time. Like I said earlier, we were really blessed to have our core stay together for as long as they have. Trust me, this is all normal and the staff is fully aware that it needs to be handled.