BearFan2000

I feel that a big part of his "decision making" problems are rooted in the lack of protection, bad play calling, and lack of threat running the ball. No one feared the run so they played coverage and were getting pressure on Jay with little effort. I know the saying is cliche but you give Jay time to scan the field he can pick you apart. But when you get the ball and as soon as you drop back you are under duress makes it difficult to go through your reads and you rush the decision making. That isn't to say that some of his picks came at times when he had time but made a bad read. Find me a QB who never ever makes a bad read and I've got some ocean front property in Nevada I'd like to sell you. The last two games the play calling was much better, the line gave him time and he was able to get into a rhythm, and we had enough of a running game to stay balanced. In those two games Jay looked nothing like the turnover machine many were making him out to be, but, more like the QB we gave up so much to get. Jay will be fine once the line stabilizes. No way do we ship off Cutler but rather he's a talent to build around. Campbell isn't the worst QB but he's not that great either. I would not get the point in downgrading a position where it is so difficult to get a talent like Cutler. IMHO someone would have to offer what we offered Denver before I even think about it. Even what we gave up I still make that trade to get Jay. As it's been pointed out we've blown 2 first rounders on QB's, one of which isn't in the league anymore and the other is barely in the league. We've also shown a track record of wasting high draft picks. We've had an endless parade of QB's who are average to below average and have had a difficult time to find a franchise QB to say the least. We finally have one who can lead us to superbowls you don't give that up, you build around him.

sorry but, in an economy where many are jobless, many are taking pay cuts to keep their jobs and many are in a salary freeze barely making it paycheck to paycheck. You have pro athletes who will balk at salary decreases that will still make them vastly higher paid than most real world people. I've been working at the same place for 11 years and am well below average in salary partly because my employer is cheap and more recently due to the economy. I barely make enough to keep the bills and mortgage paid up and have a little to set aside for emergencies. If I had half the salary of the average player it would be a lot more than I make now. Yet these guys will refuse to take a pay cut when the fans that work hard to fork over their hard earned cash to support them are barely making ends meet. Doesn't seem right.

I kinda doubt even Harry Heistad knew the details of what we were trying to do. Sure didn't look organized to me.. I like this hire and agree with BrianBear and others that if we'd have hired him as OC that would have been a bad move but I'm happy to have him as O-Line coach where he's been effective in the past. We need a guy who will bring some aggression to our line they have been soft and it's gotten old watching them get pushed around not giving Jay time or Forte running room. Definite upgrade. It is interesting that the OL coach is hired before the OC. Not sure if that means the have zero'd in on who they want for OC and this is a signing with him in mind or it is that they see the need for a significant upgrade at OL Coach and went after a guy that they feel is a significant upgrade. Usually the OC has in mind who he'd like to bring in. 1. Is this method going to limit or hinder our search for an OC if they don't get to pick their own position coaches? Will it help as Tice does have a good reputation and solid resume. That may show candidates that we are serious about improvement. 2. Not fully knowing how big a deal it is for the line coach to be brought in first since it's likely they have in mind the style of offense they would like to employ. Which I would think would still be run oriented but also be balanced in utilizing Cutler's mobility and arm. For that type of offense our line will need to be aggressive and that is more Tice's style. 3. Is this a recognition that the game starts and stops in the trenches, lose the line of scrimmage and you will have a tough time winning the game. Perhaps a sign that it was high on the priority list was to bring in someone who they feel can turn the line play around. To that end I think Tice is a good choice. I've said it before and I'll say it again, fix the line and you fix a lot of the issues. We saw what quality line play did for us in the Minny game and the Detroit game. When Jay has time to throw he's a dangerous QB, When Forte and Bell have had holes and room to run they have done well. Throughout much of the previous 14 games the lack of protection and lack of run blocking gave way to a stagnated offense that couldn't seem to get out of its own way. 4. Is this going to be the way the new look staff will be assembled each individual piece separately? If so can a patchwork staff like this work? Jerry knows he's on the hot seat and I have to think Lovie does too. It's in their best interest to piece together a staff that can turn the team around. While no one at Halas Hall will cop to it it's win or else. They've been given one more shot to make it work. Ok now, going out on a limb here but let's say for arguments sake that the Bears do put together a decent staff offensively and defensively and the Bears do turn things around in 2010... then what? Does that success have any long term potential ie the staff? Is there a possibility that given the right mix of position coaches that it would be acceptable to retain Jerry and Lovie beyond 2010? Could be the remnants of kool-aid dried to the bottom of my glass or the remaining evidence of a silver lining, but at this point this move is a good sign that they are looking to get quality coaching here. Even though Tice's head coaching stint wasn't that great it does give him a broader perspective. I like this hire.

Because Lovie has final say and only wants to surround himself with friends and yes men. I too am tired of perpetually hiring guys who for the most part are coaching positions they previously never held. Terry Shea is a good example he was well thought of coming in but once he got here it was clear he was in over his head in a parking lot puddle. I thought after the press conference that quality candidates were lined up around the building and beating down the door to get a chance to be a coordinator for this team. (sarcasm) Yet we will likely end up with the inexperienced and desperate while allowing the few qualified candidates to go elsewhere without even so much as a phone call. Do they honestly think anyone is actually fooled into thinking they are really looking for the best man for the job? Do they really think we're that stupid that we can't see through the BS? If I'm a qualified OC or DC and I'm looking for a job. I want stability, control of decision making, potential to work with, and freedom to do my job. With the Bears under a lame duck coach you have one of those things and it's not necessarily a tangible one... that's potential. There is no stability, Lovie will determine what decisions you are allowed to make in both play calling and personnel, and you will be a puppet. Yep, Chicago would be my #1 choice.

He doesn't have the Lovie connection.

Case in point of why we should have cleaned house. No one worth their salt is going to want to come in for a possible one year gig only to be flushed out the following season in favor of the next HC's guys. We have limited our options to the unqualified and/or desperate. Dedicated to winning my arse. my silver lining now looks like swiss cheese. This is playing out like typical Chicago Bears

Which is why in reality we could hire Pinocchio with delusions of being a real coach and it would be the same result. We will only bring in a guy who has ties to Lovie and will blindly run his crappy system. I'd like to be wrong but I have a feeling all we're doing is hiring a puppet. Now if Fewell is allowed to run a variation of the cover 0 like Ron did then we may see improvement. Otherwise same crap only the names are changed to protect those who are truly to blame.

Just wondering if there any people on this board who play Modern Warfare 2 on Xbox live. I would consider myself a casual gamer some of the people... ok most of the people on the multiplayer seem to take the game entirely too seriously and play it non stop. It might be fun to set up a clan or do some multiplayer matches with fellow Bear fans. This is going to be a long offseason for the Bears might be a fun way to pass the time.

The last one was great..... "I'll send my kid to that school" LOL

Thank God If they bring in Martz Jay better have his life insurance up to date, that or provide him with a riot shield. If we don't shore up the line Martz system would definitely get Jay killed. 35 sacks and countless crushing hits this year was bad enough. There's only so much abuse the human body can sustain. Jay should get the purple heart for continuing to get up and go again. If anyone ever doubted his toughness they need look at this past season

Very true, and his total yards 3,666 isn't too shabby came pretty close to Kramer's record yardage in a single season. If we'd have had decent offensive output in 2 or 3 of the games where we couldn't find the end zone he'd have broken that record as well as the completions. When the smoke cleared and I looked at his final stats for the year I had to do a double take as agonizingly horrible and difficult to watch as this season had been his stats pretty good considering he had no protection, no run game, a receiving corp with very little experience, and coming in to a new team with new system. When you step back and look at the bigger picture he got a lot out of the hand he was dealt. Then you stop and think if the line had played like they had the last two games of the season imagine what his stats could have looked like. Prior to the Monday night game I had thought that we may have completely ruined a perfectly good franchise QB but I'm pretty confident that Jay will bounce back once the line is shored up and we get decent play calling that capitalizes on his strengths.

Thanks, for some reason the picture I took Ted's face from made me instantly think of Man on the Moon "Here I come to save the day" Andy Kaufman. Threw the pic together as a coping mechanism.

nfo, you and I are on the same page, and summed up what I was thinking very well. I also like everyone else wanted Lovie gone and when that didn't happen coupled with the epic fail of a press conference and the rumors floating around that we would simply promote Rod and call it good and then bring in some chump to take over as OC. I was in such a bad mood yesterday even before the conference when it was leaked that Lovie would stay and Ron would be the obvious firing, and the likely addition of a DC to relieve Lovie of defensive play calling. I was sick to my stomach and the press conference...... words can't describe how infuriating it was to listen to. Now that the dust has settled I'm trying to take a fresh look at it. But like you when the Rod to DC rumor was squashed I breathed a big sigh of relief. I'd like to see Zimmer be the DC, and Bates the OC and if Love does let them do their thing. Zimmer brings experience beyond Lovie's box and can install a hybrid cover two with elements from various different schemes which is what Ron R. did and that is what worked in 05/06. When Ron was gone in 07 Babich basically did what lovie wanted which was primarily cover 2 with few wrinkles and was very predictable. It only got worse last year as Lovie himself took over play calling. Bringing in a DC who has a wider range of influences and if he's allowed to implement his system. Then the D could once again be decent. Also Zimmer has experience as a DC. If we get a guy like Bates who has a working relationship with Jay and knows him as good as anyone in the league you would already have a starting point. But, it's not just that he knows Jay and has that connection he helped develop Jay..... hello, a guy who can develop QB's.... have we ever had that? Jay is the present but we need to think future and his backups I think that both Hainie and Basenez would benefit under him. But he also has experience in coordinating an Offense. I think he'd be a good fit. If you have crappy assistants and coordinators it doesn't matter how much of a good coach you are. But if you have good assistants and coordinators you can be an average coach and succeed. The hands on people in the staff are the ones that make the biggest difference. If we bring in the right people the formula could work.

I vote for Bates as well, his experience in working with Jay and knowing how to structure an offense around the talents of his players is huge. I think not only for the aspect of Jay but our backups as well. having Haine and Basenez under his tutelage could be a very positive thing he knows how to develop QB's. Jay is in his prime but if we can bring in a guy who could develop guys under Jay then that to me is key. Having stepped back and let my blood pressure come back down a little. What's done is done, Lovie will be back next year. If we do bring in good OC and DC and the team can be successful. Which would mean Lovie would have to allow them to do what they do best. If that can happen would there be potential for long term success? Before I get flamed. Let me make it clear that I don't want Lovie here, and don't think the combination of Ted Phillips, Jerry Angelo, and Lovie is a good structure. But my last name isn't McCaskey so I have no say. Lovie needs to drop the stubborn arrogant attitude. Just because you didn't get canned doesn't mean it's a unanimous vote of confidence. If he learn to be flexible then there's a chance for long-term success, however, that is one big IF. Right now that's all we have as fans.

Zimmer gets my vote of the four. He is aware of the defensive world outside Lovies box. While Lovies guys have yet to discover other forms of defense than the cover 0, Zimmer seems to have the most well rounded knowledge. And he's actually held the position of Coordinator before. The reason Ron's D worked in 2005 & 2006 was because it was a variation of the Cover 2 that had root's in other systems and was a hybrid of sorts. Lovie didn't like that but if he's going to stand at a podium and talk about getting back to the defense of 05/06 then he's going to have to allow someone to do other things and interject new ideas. Lovie is so damn stubborn though. But if Zimmer would be given the reigns to taylor a Defensive scheme to the players we have that has elements of Lovies system but also has elements of other systems as well then I think it can work.

Does it really matter who we get there if they will be made to run Lovie's system.

What I got out of this.... other than a severe drop in IQ points. - Bears management's theme song is Walking Contradiction by Green Day. We need major changes..... we like the people we have. We need to bring in new ideas... we like our system whoever comes in will run out system on both sides of the ball..... It was like listening to someone playing themselves in table tennis each statement seemingly contradicted by the next. Status quo isn't good enough but we like our sturcture and we feel we can win with what we have. :banghead :banghead - We will bring in new OC and new DC but they will be puppets running our system and must agree to do so in order to be considered. So let me ask why bother changing the curtains when the window itself is shattered? - Brian is being snubbed by Mikey and Virginia and shame on them. - As usual no direct answers to any questions outside of vague generalities. - WE ARE SCREWED!!! - Money being an issue was brought up but questions dodged, translation.... you bet money was a big part of the decision. - Lovie is like that kid with the square peg frustrated at the round hole thinking it's gotta work, just need to trust me and I can make it happen. - did I mention we're screwed?

That's a good thought... pass the kool-aid

You're thinking something along the lines of trying to avoid the situation we had with DJ being HC when Angelo came in and being stuck with DJ. In Jerry's case it is kinda a wash because he brought in his own coach and look where that got us. But I can see us wanting to replace HC and GM at the same time. From that stand point is logical if that is the plan so when Angelo is replaced the new GM could bring in his coaching staff and have a real fresh start. But if if your in a "stay the course" mode with the thought of in a year or two completely cleaning house why bring in a new OC if you are considering bringing in a new GM who will inevitably bring in a new coach and new staff next year or the year after. It would explain the thought of elevating Rod so technically you are staying the course there. I think it's possible they felt they had to make some changes to appease the fans so they can say they made changes. But they may be prepping for a real house cleaning. But the question remains why wait to do it if it's likely to happen baring significant improvement of the product on the field?

This makes no sense either... The TE's have been fairly solid for us under Boras. So we dump what is working, retain and even promote what isn't working... Are they trying to make the Bears worse? What next fire Toub because he's too good at his job? Shouldn't the restructure of a staff have the goal of keeping what's good and looking to upgrade where possible? Seems we are doing the opposite.

Two words...... They're cheap

These moves were predicted on this board. We all had a hunch that Ron would be the scapegoat, management would go the cheap route and keep Lovie, and some here speculated that Rod would be elevated to DC..... These moves scream cheap and we don't care about winning. Fire OC, keep Failing HC, promote someone already on the payroll to DC who has virtually no experience running a D, we'll likely hire someone's buddy to be OC who's never done it before (maybe even someone in house like Pep)....... Then in the off-season between 2010 and 2011 after another "disappointing" season they may do what they should have done this off-season and clean house. That's my prediction that next year at this time we'll be right back where we are now. Here's to a shitty 2010 Bears season.... I guess the fans have to be storming Halas Hall with torches and pitch forks before they see the error of their ways. DJ had a shorter leash than this Lovie must have quite the photo album of compromising pictures. The case to fire him is stacked yet he gets another pass. Considering that we'll likely bring in someone at OC who doesn't know his butt from a hole in the ground (not that Ron did), and I hate to say this but I'd have rather us stuck with turner than get someone with no experience... and I would bet on it that we will get someone who's never done it before at any level. Rod Marinelli will be handcuffed and forced to run Lovies fatally flawed cover 0 defense. With Lovie as HC does it really matter who carries the DC title??? I mean really? And if it fails again next year, and it will, Rod will be the one to blame even though he's forced to run Lovie's system. With Lovie still as head coach prepare to watch unprepared players play uninspired football until it doesn't matter anymore and it's once again "save my job time." This organization (if you can even call it that) makes me sick. What have we as fans done to deserve a team that always sinks to the lowest common denominator. We deserve better.

Reporting on the score that there will be a press conference tomorrow 1/5/10 at 2pm Today all media, assistants, and players were gone and a meeting closed door meeting with high level brass to discuss the future of the Bears. While most of us feel there's enough daming evidence to justify giving the axe to Lovie and his staff. Who knows how it will shake out.

So true, not everyone is like our GM who will give a 2nd rounder away for a backup level player.

IMHO Jays numbers are tainted by bad play calling, poor protection, and lack of run game. The last two games we did all three of these things better and the difference in Cutler's performance was night and day. Go figure. If the line played like that more this year and we had decent success running, and Ron actually catered to Cutler's strengths, you could argue that Jay's numbers would be much better. Of the two QB's Orton benefited from a ground game and a good O-Line. While Cutler didn't yet his numbers are close Orton's. Makes me think that had we still had Orton we'd have seen worse stats for our QB.