Stinger226
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Posts posted by Stinger226
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1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said:
Yes, I JUST wrote "And of course Ersery was on my radar and Trapilo wasnt, so it was a surpise for me, but Im willing to say that was a good trade."
cool
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1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said:
no its not the original contract anymore - they extended it, which means a new longer deal.
You may be right but both OTC and SpoTrac show him on a 3 year deal from 2023.
Tyson Bagent signed a 3 year, $2,720,000 contract with the Chicago Bears, including $25,000 signing bonus, $25,000 guaranteed, and an average annual salary of $906,667. In 2025, Bagent will earn a base salary of $1,030,000, while carrying a cap hit of $1,038,334 and a dead cap value of $8,334.
the Bears website under team shows a heading (transactions) that list every transction done since the begining of the year and I cant find that extension.
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16 minutes ago, adam said:
Bagent signed a 3-year UDFA deal, so technically, he is not on a typical 4 or 5-year rookie deal. This is the last year of that deal.
What ever you want to call it, he is under the original deal when we first obtained him. He was a rookie when he signed it so I called it a rookie contract, I dont know of more technical names.
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13 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
Here's an interesting idea. Im not saying it will happen, but it has occurred to me.
Given these facts:
Case Keenum has said in interviews that he had planned to retire before this offseason, and then he met with Ben Johnson, and that turned him around.
Keenum's primary role on this team is to mentor Caleb.
We just paid Tyson Bagent, extending his contract.
Roster spots are precious.
Is it possible that Keenum will transition from player to coach when we cut down the roster? I could see him as Caleb's mentor, and he doesnt need to be a player to do that.
Just thinking about stuff. Not saying i know it will happen, but it does fit the facts, and open a roster spot on the 53?
Tyson Bagent is still on his rookie contract, I think they like him so not sure they would put him on the PS. Clearly Keenum was brought in to help mentor Caleb and may end up on the 53 man roster. I think every rookie makes the 53. They will play with the roster to guess who can be put on the PS to make sure they dont lose him.
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6 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
right, Im talking about the tradedowns after that. 3rd round and later.
I would have taken Ersery at 41, but if Trapilo works out, then that trade down was fantastic, and Turner (is that who you meant instead of Stewart?) is going to be great for us. So that trade down worked out OK *IF* Trapilo is good.
And of course Ersery was on my radar and Trapilo wasnt, so it was a surpise for me, but Im willing to say that was a good trade.
Im talking about after that, when we let HBs go, traded down, and then saw them stolen right before we picked - I think that happened twice? Like we were going down our HB list, and kept getting played.
The question was more like KJ or Sketebo vs Rah the CB and someone else from the 5th round.Did you ever thing they didnt value Ersery as high as you did? If they valued him, they would have taken him. You think they moved back thinking they could still get him. Maybe they liked Trapilo more. The first four picks by their reactions, told me they wanted them, not settled for someone else. That is the reason they traded back. They also may not have seen RB as that critical of a need. That is what pundits projected.
We assume a lot of what they thought, wanted, and did. Its not any different than thinking they would have took Banks. Poles has no problem moving arouind to get players, moving a couple spots to get Banks was doable if that mattered. Im saying that wasnt their plan. In the war room video, at 9.47 BJ tells Colston, he played the highlight video before the draft to give the rest of the room a little insight on where they would go. That sounds like they intented to take him. Also At 9.10 Jeff King says that the more they watched film the more that knew Colston was the pick for them.
If I could see the Jeff King conversation, then I would understand your points. I have extensively looked and cant find it. Lots of tape of CC talking about the draft and who they liked, but I think more her opinion than repeating what Jeff King said. I know he had a press conference its just about how he worded statements.
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I think DA blitzes alot and does a lot of line stunts. Im not saying we are going to have low points scored against us but will produce more TOs and big plays.
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Since the Bears are not telling everything decision making in this draft , no one is right or wrong. I assume your talking about Ersery or a RB. They could have liked Ozzy more than Ersery but we will never know. Teams value players differently depending on how they think a player will fit their team. Everyone can be right because we will never know. I will say, Kyle Monongai was not their first, second or even 3rd choice for a RB. I still think he will ball out and none of it matters.
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I guess if I was part of Media,I would jump at anything to write about
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9 minutes ago, adam said:
and Patrick Finley asking one of the most ridiculous questions of all-time "Caleb, does your dad speak for you?"
Can you imagine asking a grown man this question and being serious about it? Our media has always been mixed, either super homer or super negative, but this is on an entirely new level of stupid. The media gets Caleb for only a few minutes to ask questions you can't get anywhere else and he felt it was necessary to get that answer?Besides that other media pundits praise Finley for asking the important questions. I would have just told Finley ,( you cant be serious with that question)
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7 hours ago, DABEARSDABOMB said:
He owned it well - I also liked some of the quotes from Johnson on how he watched film with Caleb on how he reacted on field in terms of showing emotions and is working with him on that too…going back to all the little things matter.
Caleb handled this little issue well and I think he has learned from it too.
I like everything the Bears are giving us right now. BJ expects the best of everyone and Caleb looks more definite in learning. It is all a good situation for the success of the team going forward. I think we have a Perfect Storm brewing and it will surprise most of the fanbase. I in turn, am all in.
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7 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
Ok i watched some of Stinger's highlights, and I should amend my point, and maybe this brings me more into harmony with what Mongo is saying.
When the play breaks, and Daniels scrambles, he does look around. I should have included that caveat.
I guess Im saying on regular downs when the play is still in rhythm, i dont see a lot of reading. maybe hes only being given 2 reads, and told to get the ball out fast? Across the season i did see a lot of that. It looked like 1 read or run and create. Sometimes it looked like a scripted look off. I think I said 90% of the time hes a one read guy, so yes there are plays where he looks to a second read.
In fact the first play of the tape, you can see his head move ever so much when he comes off the primary read, and on to Ertz. I might also say thats evidence of him turning his head to make a read too - but I admit he did get to his second read on that one.
Maybe the truth is more like 70%, and you guys are saying 60% and Im saying 90% or something, meaning maybe a difference in how often it feels like it happens - I surely havent counted, I assume no one has. So my impression was that hes a one read guy, and you guys are saying maybe he does read more than I think?
Either way, i dont think he is a fully functional pocket QB. Maybe we agree on that too.
I agree with you on the majority of the time it was one read. I think in most cases, if not open the run option was in order. I just dont think you base his future as quarterback on his first year in judging whether he can expand his QB skills on reading defenses. I think Kingsburg kept it simple for him in the first year on purpose. The results were , they were winning games. In the same light I think the Bears put to much on the plate for Caleb and part of the reason he struggled. Poor coaching doomed Caleb from looking better.
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7 hours ago, AZ54 said:
The only thing I've seen is how happy Ben Johnson was when they drafted Colston Loveland. When he met Loveland at Halas Hall he said "I turned on your tape yesterday and little did they (the scouts and coaches in the room) know it was just a little insight into where we were headed." That didn't look or sound at all like a consolation prize. Contrast that with some of the later round picks all the way to Monangai where he's just making matter of fact welcome to the team statements. Link is marked to start on the quote:
I agree, also I think the Burden pick was a surprise because they didnt expect him to be there. At that point I thought they planned at trading 39 or 41 before the draft to have another high pick. they traded 41 for 56 and 62. Poles mentioned whether to pick DL or OT first and ended up getting the two players they wanted Ozzy and Shemar. They seemed elated with all of their first 4 picks. (watch their body language). As you watch the rest of the picks, the body language was different.
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7 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
I havent found it yet - it was from Halas Hall, with Jeff King, who was standing to the left of CC from our perspective (CC's right) I remember the setup very clearly. Ill keep looking.
In the meanwhile, here is CC saying it without attributing it. She says it in a definite way, so shes not expressing a guess. She had already said these were facts in the video Im not finding, but at least you can hear her say it with some authority.
Go to 50:30
I watched this one before. She talks about the 3 players that they were interested in . Goes on to say( I just think). I get that is what she thought but I cant find anywhere where Jeff King says it. Being interested in players and drafting them are two different convesations. I have watched many of her interviews and she brings up (what she thinks they should do) or her impression of what they want to do. She brings up about she thought RB and LT were their priorities, no where can I find where the Bears mentioned that at pick 10. Why did they not move up two spots to take Banks, if he was the target? That would have been a cheap move one or two spots. Poles as shown before he has no problem moving around the draft to get players he wants.
They clearly were going to draft a RB and a LT prospect somewhere in the draft, my point in the way the draft fell, they were targeting Loveland. As AZ said, he showed the war room tape of Colston before the draft started. If I was in the room and didnt know who they were targeting , that could be a clue they wanted him and wasnt getting him in the second round. Now if Jeanty was there, I think they may have taken him but I think they had planned (guessing the draft board) of taking a prospect in the second round. They ended up with 3 picks in the second.
None of this matters anyways , no matter who we thought they were taking, they didnt take one player I thought they were interested in. I think they targeted Loveland at 10. I think they liked Tripilo in the second and thought they could get him. They dont set their draft board according to what the general public thinks the best players are.
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Daniels was the best rookie QB last year measured by stats and winning. Most of his throws are one reads or runs. Im sure Kingbury did not try to overload him his first year. I watched the Chicago-Washington highlights. He throw to his 2nd or 3rd reads 4 times. He can become a better QB with good coaching. Protection was spotty for him so as for Caleb, better protection can give him more time for progressions.
Another reason to watch the game is seeing what Swift is capable of . He looked good in that game.
Also we were 4-2 and minus a brainfart from Stevenson, we could have been 5-2 and a totally different direction for the season. Now the coaching was still a problem and the team quit on Flus, but we could still have salvaged a winning season.
NFL wont let me post it but if you click on Watch on Youtube it will open up.
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28 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:
CC absolutely interviewed Jeff King on camera, and he said half of this, and the other half she attributed to him later in her own interview. I saw it with my own eyes, i feel like I even pasted to it on this board.
You can say it didnt happen. Whatever. You win because things that happened never happened. Cool.
As far as trading down, Poles took a gamble a certain player would be there later and they werent multiple times. Thats not a win for Poles.
it IS OK for the Bears to not be perfect you know? Its Ok to criticize the bad stuff and praise the good stuff. Nothing is going to happen if we think the Bears had some stumbles in the draft. I dunno, maybe you're superstitious, but our comments cant hurt the bears, and it is OK to look at the good and the bad both. It's even ok to cut, trade or fire people who might be replaced by people who would be better. That's good for the team.I goggled it and could not find it. I have watched 6 CC interviews, can you link it to me? Its not on her X account and Im not on TikTok or Snapchat Im not calling you a liar, I just cant find it. I spend an hour looking for it. I even suffered thru 2 TTNLs videos looking for it. She mentioned talking to him on two videos but never mentioned ( they were going to draft Banks on it).
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Simply the book is a non story.
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21 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:
OK youre missing two very important details.
1) It was said AFTER the draft, not before. CC says she spoke to the dir of player personnel after the draft, and he said Loveland wasnt necessarily their first choice, that if Banks had fallen, for example, they would have taken him. I believe CC is not a liar. I feel like it may even have been partly on video, so you could see hm say it - Jeff something.
2) It matters who was available when, because we did trade down multiple times. *IF* we traded down thinking we would get a certain targeted HB at a lower pick, one who was still available on the board BEFORE the trade down, and we could have just picked them then, but instead if we traded down and then someone got in front of us and took the HB, then that means we read the situation poorly, and missed out on HBs we were targeting more than Monangai. If it happened multiple times, then it is fair to criticize the draft process as having misread the board, and missed out on players we mistakenly thought would be available later, got greedy, and missed the HB that was targeted.
And even if that did happen, I'm not unhappy value-wise with the players we DID pick either, but if you're going to be evaluating the team, you gotta look into the places where they failed too. Is it fireable? No it's not. But that doesnt mean it isnt important. It's important in the continued evaluation of Poles who has done some amazing things, some good things, gotten lucky some, made some very questionable moves, and a few flat out bad decisions too.
For me, right now, Poles is getting a B. Maybe a B+, and most of that is due to Caleb and Johnson, two massive pieces we got VERY right. But Caleb was luck as much as anything, and Johnson picked the Bears because of Caleb. So Poles could easily have lost both of them, if the Texans don't score a last minute touchdown in the last game of the season that didnt matter to them.
For me, that all adds up to: Poles is worth keeping an eye on. I'm not totally sold on him or Warren. Not the way I am about the coaching staff, for example.1) I watched 5 CC interviews and never does she say King told her they were takng Banks if he was there. Im on her X account and cant find that statement. Point being every interview I have seen, its always her opinion they were trading up for Jeanty (to expensive)or going to take Campbell or Banks. The interview with King only said they were interested in 3 other top 10 draft picks. I have no problem with her opinion many people made those statements but there was never an insider saying they were doing that. That doesnt make her a liar. Every interview she gave before the draft was talk about RBs, LT and DT. Every interview she has stated this is a BJ driven draft.
2) Of course it matters who's there. Last year Poles was willing to trade a few spots to get Odunze and Cunningham told him to be patient. So if they want someone they would trade at least a few spots to get them. Any team would want Jeanty so the thought they might traded for him was always in play. but with with Banks at 9, nothing. I think they targeted Loveland. Another indicator was BJ played a Colston highlight film before the first round to the rest of the war room. I think they had intentions of always trading one of the 2 2nd rounds picks because of several positions to address. So they may have wanted Henderson but didnt trade a few spots to get him. They seen Bruden available and decided he was worth keeping on that pick and took what they could get with 41 to still add a OT and DL, both they deemed needs. They had to know chances are Ersery not being there at 56, he went at 48. Between 41 and 56 4 edge players, 2 DT, and 2 LTs went off the board. I think when they traded back they had both Ozzy and Shemar on their radar and got who they wanted. Just as easy to say they got who they targeted instead they misjudged the board. C
Cant say about any of the other picks but I think they got 3 of what they planned to get with the first 4 picks. Burden was the outlier, being available they went to plan B or even C with getting a RB, they passed on Henderson with what would have been an easy trade if they wanted him. They liked Bruden better.
In round 4 , Scattabo went at 105 and they easily could have moved up to get him but instead moved back because they got a couple players available they wanted.
In the 7th round I think they maybe liked either Brashard Smith or Damien Martinez but went before their pick. Monangai was available and that's who they ended up with. We have no way of knowing of how they ranked their RBs , Kyle may have been 4th or 5th on their list. If we go by attention they paid before the draft.
1) Jeanty ( cost to great)
2) Henderson
3) Scattabo
4) Brashard Smith
Everyone has an opinion on how the draft should have went, I think they pretty well got the players they wanted. Kyle Monangai will prove valueable. We wont know what is right or wrong for a couple of years.
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35 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:
CC reported that Bears employees, including director of player personnel said they wanted players that were gone before they picked, and specifically Jeanty, Banks and Campbell, and Henderickson later. She named her source, and also exactly when he said it (immediately after the draft)
So either you think she is lying, or youre just trying to ignore these facts because they dont fit your "everything is perfect" narrative.
Now even if the Bears did get out maneuvered on the board, it doesnt mean the draft was a failure. Poles may have miscalculated who would be there at times, but we still stayed true to our board and got value. So this isnt me saying he was awful either.
But reality is messy, and is almost never "they got it exactly how they wanted it, its perfect"I read the remarks after the draft, can you show me the video where she states it before the draft? I have seen interviews where Poles talks about all three of those players, of course he liked them, but other than the first pick in the draft no GM is going to broadcast who they are taking.
Actually it doesnt matter because they were not available and they didnt move up to take any of them or even talked about that.
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1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said:
Ok, so I watched the episode. Lots of great highlight film on players. I was especially happy to see Turner's film. I think he was a steal. He should help us a lot.
I do think the beginning where they say "Let's start with Loveland" was a little bit suspect. It's not clear that they started with him out of the gate, or if they were doing tight ends there, or what.
We have heard from Courtney Cronin that the Bears would have taken Jeanty, Campbell or Banks over Loveland if any of them had been there, so I dunno if the film really says anything - it was edited tightly to the beginning of those words, and there is nothing from the draft before the pick.
Still and all, the Bears were obviously very high on Loveland, and pleased that he was available for them. He's gonna be a great player for us, I believe.
But I don't know that this film really does anything to dispel the idea that Poles miscalculated on HB availability through several trade downs. That's not to say that the players they did get were bad - they arent. It looks like a solid crop of rookies that can help us, including the HB we eventually did get, Monangai who looks great. I just don't think everything went perfectly according to plan on draft day either? Or at least, this film isn't proof that it did.Since none of them were available, we will never know. After they made the draft pick, the next day BJ said he showed a highlight video before the draft to show a little insight in where they were going with the pick to the war room. At 9.45 . It was Loveland. Through out the draft they seemed like they guess who people were taking and were pretty spot on, so they knew none of those other picks would be there. CC has no inside information other than they liked those players. Im sure they liked Carter and Hunter to but knew they wouldnt be there.
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You do notice, none of them were juggernaut defenses either.
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I like these kind of videos that let you see the backroom of these teams.
BJ saying he played the highlight film right before the draft tells me they were targeting Loveland all along.
It seems like all the position coaches had a lot of input into the picks.
It seems they stayed at 39 when Burden was available and projected the next 2 players they wanted and got them in the trade back.
BJ was all in on the picks and obviously he had input into those selections.
Eric Beinemy seemed like the only one very excited to get Monangai.
I would say they got done what they wanted to in the draft ,at least, they like who they got.
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I also seen where Jeff King was interviewed for a GM job but dont remember the team. If they have success this year and King leaves (Adam) would we get a pick or do you have to be black to get the comp pick?