BearFan PHX

cool - I dont think its that big of a deal, but it certainly isnt wrong or anything.

If Braxton is a lot better than Trapilo of course he will start, but if it's close, like Trapilo is a little rough, but Braxton is weak on the bull rush Trapilo has a little trouble to the outside, but Braxton's issue is up the middle, and let's say Braxton is a 73 and Trapilo is a 71 then Trapilo will get the job. Unless Braxton is a beast like weve never seen him be before, he is not getting a second contract, and they will let Trapilo play because he is more likely to get better over the season than Jones.

I agree, the scrimmages are very important. But I think it's less about protecting tape and secrets, and more about putting your players in scripted and controlled situations to see what you need to see, avoid exposing them to injury on reps that arent worth it. You get what you need to get, rather than hoping it comes up in a game. And you dont need to risk players on any extra plays. I wouldnt be shocked to see the #1s out there in the game for one series, and i wouldnt be shocked if they dont play at all either. We'll see how Johnson wants to play it, but I wouldnt expect a quarter or a half from the #1s when as you say the scrimmages are already so valuable.

how do you know that? i contend that if Jones is slightly better than Trapilo he will still play Trapilo so that Trapilo grows and the line gets experience going forward into the future. They're building toward a Superbowl, and so every decision has to be in line with that. Not winning one more game this year, and then starting over next year. That's poor strategy. And ask yourself, who would be better by week 6 if you start them each from week 1? What if Jones is a little better now, but by midseason you think Trapilo will grow into a better option if he plays? I think that's how football teams look at this stuff, especially when it comes to rookies who can change their level of ability quickly from green to getting it in a few games. Weve all seen it before, playing the green rookie with upside over the known vet who might be better right now. Now if Trapilo is terrible, or Jones is amazing, then all bets are off. But if they are at all close, Trapilo gets the job.

Thats an interesting battle. We know what Braxton is and isnt, but you gotta test Trpilo under fire to see if he can handle it. I feel like this is Trapilos job to win or lose on his own merit, I dont imagine Jones coming out radically different than he's been and playing himself into a new contract. I mean just the fact that Poles has spent a 3rd rounder and then a 2nd rounder on the position the last two years should tell us what they think of Braxton's future. If Trapilo cant handle the upper tier of NFL Edge rushers, then maybe Jones gets the job, but if Trapilo shows anything at all, it's his job. Jones is almost certainly gone by next year, so even if Jones edges Trapilo out by a little, it'll still be Trapilo's job - and he will grow and gain chemistry with the other guys going into the future.

totally agree, and I think thats why the order here is purposefully not making any real comment on who is winning or losing the camp battles. I mean no way Monanagi is behind Homer. The league makes them put out a depth chart, and so they did, but i think they did it in a way that tells everyone "none of this is necessarily real"

all true, but I dont think that depth chart will stay that way long - I really think it's more a matter of having to provide one before the preseason game, and less about communicating anything about what the coaches plan to do opening day. Its SO tantilizing because we all want answers to those questions, and here is something that looks like a fact - but I dont think it really is. I need to see it myself anyway to have an actual opinion on the depth chart, and unfortunately I dont think the preseason is going to give us that. as for Trapilo and Burden, it's all good that we disagree, since it's just a gut instinct anyway at this point. I don't have any real info. Maybe if I saw the players I'd be all in on Jones? I have no idea. But I do know that Jones is in the last year of his deal, and Trapilo is in the first year of his rookie deal, and consistency on the OL is really important, so that tells me Trapilo has the edge if they're close. But I havent seen them play this year, so maybe Id have a strong opinion for one or the other if I had. Stinger said some beat writer said they purposely put the rookies behind for this initial depth chart. Cool. That may be another way of what you're saying too - that they have to keep growing to earn it. In any case, no matter who wins these battles, I dont think this depth chart means anything real? EDIT - and to your point about Burden, I assume you have JP Richardson as one of the ones ahead of Burden, but he is listed as "other" behind Burden. At WR, the 1st stringers are Moore and Odunze The 2nd stringers are Zaccheaus and Duverney The 3rd stringers are Burden and Boykin And then Richardson, Scott, Toure, Alexander, Jackson and Walker are "other" At RB, 1st string is Swift 2nd string is Johnson 3rd string is Homer and Wheeler, Monangai and Hankins are "other" So I dont think this depth chart is a real report on what the coaches are thinking right now. And that makes sense. The competition is still going on, so why praise and punish the competitors? Instead they come up with a generalized "rookies not named Loveland are put down on the list for now" rule. It's not a glimpse into how people are doing, it's just some BS, and we are SO hungry for info (myself included) that we look to it, but i dont think its got any real info.

That sounds right. There is no way Burden is so far back, and i think Trapilo is ahead of Jones, but thats just a gut feeling.

certainly a possibility. I also think the depth chart today isn't real. I heard somewhere (was it on CHGO?) that the coaches may not even have participated in it. Whatever the case, it will change over the next few weeks for sure.

I wouldnt want to try to predict when this offense will be rolling, but it seems that if they keep making progress, they have everything to get it rolling, and thatrs gonna be really fun. It seems very likely that given enough time, these guys are gonna be dangerous. Hopefully early, but either way, eventually.

I think Dennis Allen served a wake up call to the offense in front of the family crowd and embarassed and challenged them. This physical practice is probably the result of that - and it's good to see people getting dialed in. They will have to do a bunch more gut checks accompanied by a step up in intensity like this until they are ready to dominate other NFL teams. In the past I think we've tried to hang with NFL teams. It requires another level of intensity to dominate a pro team. When they're at the level that they see each week as an actual fight and nothing less than a beat down is OK, THEN this team will be a real contender. Another step forward. Keep stacking them.

exactly. But Miami will. He was pretty good on his college tape, moves well laterally, and is naturally wide. But some of these pass rushers have speed and hands and they are slippery as hell. Cant wait to see Trapilo try to handle that. And even if he gets beat a few times, if he learns, that will be great.

I agree with both of you. Id like to see it soon, but it might take a minute, but it's hard to imagine this group not figuring it out over time. The roster and the staff are much better than anything we've seen in quite a while, and in some ways, ever. I dont want to have patience, and I am going to see every mistake in the early games of course, but if it doesnt come fast, that doesnt mean it isnt coming. We will see what needs fixing, and if players need replacing - which isnt always the same thing at all. If Trapilo is rough early for example that's different than if DJ Moore is screwing up. One you expect to have a growth period, and the other is a polished pro who should be his normal great self. But i think this team should grow into something special, and i hope it happens fast, but if it takes a minute, we should be seeing growth at least. I won't lose hope right away if we start slow.

no. youre being dumb again. cap space absolutely matters. you need to make sure everyone on your team is playing up to what you pay them. wasted cap space is a problem. IF you have a top stud available, you can push cap space around to create space for them. and they also have to play up to their pay too. You cant keep pushing cap space around - it does matter - but for a single real stud you can find room. It binds you up then, but its Ok because you have that star player. This isnt controversial either - everyone who is paying attention knows this. I am surprised you dont.

lol youre still doing it. Agreed that the trade probably wont happen. Didnt agree on three of your points about why. Why do we have to pretend you didnt say them now? Just let it be, i dont need to keep talking about it, as long as you stop having some oversimplified last word like it didnt happen LOL

I'll tell you a little story to help explain this mysterious concept to you. A little boy named Stingy asks his Daddy if they are going to but a new car. Stingy's Daddy says "no we cant afford one" Little Stingy thinks for a minute and then says "I understand Daddy, we cant buy a new car for four reason. For one it's too expensive." And his father nods his head yes. Then littler Stingy says "and also Daddy, 2+2 = 7, pigs can fly and the moon is made out cheese, those are the other reasons why we cant buy a new car" Little Stingys Daddy is disappointed in his son, and says "No little Stingy, only the first reason is the reason why" Then Little Stingy says "so you agree we arent buying a new car, so all the reasons must be true - you must be off your meds" Little Stingy's Daddy is ashamed. Little Stingy must be drunk, no one could be that massively stupid. The Little Stingy says "Dont worry Daddy, Im not stupid, i was just lying about not understanding because i wanted to make it look like i wasnt wrong." The moral of the story is that just because something is true doesnt mean every possible justification for it is valid, and also little Stingy is slippery in his logic, to cover up for when he says things that dont make sense.

Yes you did just show me how stupid you are by proposing that bet. Do you think i am saying the trade WILL happen? Are you not understanding? THe trade will likely not happen because the trade cost will be too high. Your other arguments are wrong. They are not reasons the deal wont happen. The reason the deal wont happen is because the trade cost is too high. So how the hell am I betting the trade will happen? Are you making any sense at all?

you are SUCH a moron. I am NOT saying the trade is going happen, Im arguing with you about WHY its not going to happen. Read that again so you get it now the 4th or 5th time Ive said it. 1) the trade value will be too high - we agree - so the trade will not happen. Right. 2) cap space - youre wrong, treams can create it for special circumstances by redoing other deals, we've all seen it before in the NFL, maybe you didnt understand it 3) sync'ed contracts - dont even know what youre talking about - its better to have contracts spaced apart so they dont all come due at once. i think youre misunderstanding the thing about HC and GM being sync'ed with players contracts. If anything you want your big defender while Caleb is still a rookie 4) not a scheme fit - this is the most typical of your blatant misunderstanding of football and how you get your information from sportswriters. You think there is a scheme that adding Micah Parsons wouldnt be a good thing? your arguments, 2, 3 & 4 are dumb. You dont like that i disagreed with you and now youre having an emotional reaction again. I cant help it that you say dumb things that get pushed back on. If you want all your opinions to be held in high regard, then say smart things. Or... maybe youre listening to the wrong sportswriters and are getting frustrated when you try to bring their narratives here and they dont work. Also, to your idea that Im "trying to get people to agree with me" - no. I was being nice and answering your question. You asked how they could find cap room so i told you.

OK. Teams are able to restructure contracts to push money into the future. For almost any team, there is cap space available that you can create. You make the deal 5 years long, and guarantee a big chunk of it, then you get to pay that off the cap 20% across each year. Next year there is a lot of cap space available as you look at players like Edmunds, Jaylon Johnson, Cole Kmet, even DJ Moore. Im not saying you have to trade or cut those guys either. You can restructure their deals as well. Or you can do what most successful terams do and identify a couple core vets on your squad and move on the others in trades. If the question is whether a rookie next year can take Kmet's place, or Edmunds etc vs how big an upgrade Parsons would be, I think Parsons is the easy answer. If you wouldnt trade Kmet and Edmunds for Parsons then you're insane. That doesnt mean Kmet and Edmunds arent good - I just think you fail to understand that QB and Edge Rusher are the two things that make championship teams. Look how the Eagles' pass rush destroyed Mahomes. The QB is the thing you NEED, and if an edge player has that QB on his ass, then you dont have a QB, see? Anyway, for the right player, teams can make cap room. If Parsons was a free agent, we would sign him in an instant, and be in the 6 teams or so in superbowl contention.

OK here you go again, playing word games to hide yourself, and throwing in some personal stuff to make it sound tough. So first off, we have agreed the price or the trade alone makes it not happen. Yes. But it isnt that simple. We talked about WHY, and you still dont get that any team that had it would love to pay this guy. Im not smoking pot, Im paying a top player in the league at one of the two most important positions in football what they are worth. You dont get that? You also say he isnt a scheme fit - absolute nonsense. And finally you say something about contracts being sync'ed - also total fantasies. So yes, we agree that the trade probably wont happen, but you have three reasons why out of four that make no sense at all. As fot asking if im high, and suggesting I contact Poles about this - man your anger issues are coming out again. Because i said you were wrong. Because youa re.

I completely agree that I predict Jerry Jones will want too much in trade value. Ive said it over and over - that is WHY the trade probably wont happen. All Im pushing back on are these ridiculous arguments: 1) We dont have the cap space - they can always push money around and make space for a player like Parsons if he is available to us 2) He doesnt fit the scheme - he fits every scheme. Every team in the league would love to have him if they could swing it 3) His contract doesnt align with Caleb's - so what?! The alignment thing was to be sure players were still here, there is nothing wrong with having a stud pass rusher around for more years, in fact we are more likely to be able to afford him before Calebs 2nd deal anyway. And you try to draft or acquire good players every year, so contracts are always staggered - which is smart because you dont want everyone coming due for an extension at the same time. I think Stinger has misunderstood why syncing the GM and HC is a great idea, and is trying to extend that to the players? But the reason it wont happen is the trade cost, nothing else. That's what im saying. But strange things do happen, and so you gotta do your due diligence. I do think the Bears could make a move before the seasons starts on the Defensive Line. Will it be Parsons? probably not. But its not impossible.

the odds of the Bears getting Parsons are considerably more likely that winning the lottery. I have said that it probably wont happen because of the trade value needed. But I also think the contract length and cap space would be FINE. Youre just muddling it all together and saying it wont happen - and youre probably right, but NOT because of synced contracts or cap space - thats where youre wrong. And when you say he doesnt fit the scheme, thats just insanity. Micah Parsons fits EVERY scheme. Every team in the league would take him if they could afford him. When you say we already have Dayo, so we dont need Parsons thats where youre absolutely smoking crack.

I truly dont understand your thinking. The whole point of having a QB on a rookie deal is to have cap space to add highly paid players while you can afford them BEFORE you pay Caleb. What do you think the benefit of having players with deals that end with Calebs is? On one hand they are around until then, you dont lose them early - but what would be the downside of having a great pass rusher who has a contract that extends beyond Calebs? Im think you dont understand why the contracts are synced - and think there is some benefit to it that you dont understand? The problem here is what the trade would cost, not the cap or contract.

we still might get him! who knows? I can tell you Poles is looking into it 100%.

Sadly, Parsons didnt say hed take less to go to Chicago. That was a hoax unfortunately.