QB thread

[Stinger226]

We all have  to remember Poles drafting habits, he likes athletic prospects.  Daniels would seem to be the perfect example. He said he needed someone to blow him away to draft #1. Whether you  like him or not Poles has made the last 2 years off season the most anticipated since I have been a Bear fan. Lots of drama coming. There are so many opinions you will see it will be at nauseum. If people really knew how to pick a great QB, there wouldnt be so many making bad picks.  The is its very hard.

[BearFan PHX]

1 hour ago, Alaskan Grizzly said:

Not necessarily a fan of Williams’ but Drew Brees is/was 6’0”.   Allegedly.  
 

I remember someone saying years ago he often had to stand on his toes to get a clearer shot of his target.  

right, there are always exceptions, and maybe Williams is one of them, but 6' 0" aint good for a QB

[adam]

9 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

We all have  to remember Poles drafting habits, he likes athletic prospects.  Daniels would seem to be the perfect example. He said he needed someone to blow him away to draft #1. Whether you  like him or not Poles has made the last 2 years off season the most anticipated since I have been a Bear fan. Lots of drama coming. There are so many opinions you will see it will be at nauseum. If people really knew how to pick a great QB, there wouldnt be so many making bad picks.  The is its very hard.

The great Dick Jauron once said "Finding a good QB is about as hard as finding the G-Spot". 

[Stinger226]

2 hours ago, adam said:

The great Dick Jauron once said "Finding a good QB is about as hard as finding the G-Spot". 

Actually that's not that hard, it just takes a lot of research.

[adam]

2 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

Actually that's not that hard, it just takes a lot of research.

"That's what she said"!

[Stinger226]

This is the reason I worry about Williams and he's the top rated QB.

 

[Pixote]

7 minutes ago, Stinger226 said:

This is the reason I worry about Williams and he's the top rated QB.

 

I agree 100%. I've watched him against several of the top ranked teams, including my Notre Dame team (who also has a habit of losing to top ranked teams, damn it). He seems to choke against high level competition. I will be curious what he does against #16 ranked Louisville on 12/27.

[ChileBear]

41 minutes ago, Pixote said:

I agree 100%. I've watched him against several of the top ranked teams, including my Notre Dame team (who also has a habit of losing to top ranked teams, damn it). He seems to choke against high level competition. I will be curious what he does against #16 ranked Louisville on 12/27.

He's not playing that game. And I agree, i'd pass on him as no. 1. 

 

[Stinger226]

6 hours ago, ChileBear said:

He's not playing that game. And I agree, i'd pass on him as no. 1. 

 

I'm not saying he wont be a good QB but definitely not generational. He got his hype from winning the Heisman last yr but hasnt played in big games.  

[Bears4Ever_34]

On 12/10/2023 at 11:47 AM, Pixote said:

I agree 100%. I've watched him against several of the top ranked teams, including my Notre Dame team (who also has a habit of losing to top ranked teams, damn it). He seems to choke against high level competition. I will be curious what he does against #16 ranked Louisville on 12/27.

I'd be curious to know what those numbers looked like on last year's team. USC was not a very talented football team this year, outside of Williams. It's not surprising to me they'd look worse against better competition. That defense and OL have been bad since Reily got there. Losing Addison at WR probably hurt the passing game, too. 

[AZ54]

On 12/10/2023 at 10:36 AM, Stinger226 said:

This is the reason I worry about Williams and he's the top rated QB.

 

Yeah there's a shrinking violet theme to his work.  He's also not Justin Fields fast or strong.  I've come to realize how spoiled I've been watching Fields run.  

[ChileBear]

11 minutes ago, AZ54 said:

Yeah there's a shrinking violet theme to his work.  He's also not Justin Fields fast or strong.  I've come to realize how spoiled I've been watching Fields run.  

Yep, if the choice is keeping Fields or drafting Williams, I keep Fields.

[BearFan PHX]

55 minutes ago, AZ54 said:

Yeah there's a shrinking violet theme to his work.  He's also not Justin Fields fast or strong.  I've come to realize how spoiled I've been watching Fields run.  

yeah he really is the best running QB ever. And he will end up with those rushing numbers pretty soon.
 

41 minutes ago, ChileBear said:

Yep, if the choice is keeping Fields or drafting Williams, I keep Fields.

You might be right, but of course there are other rookie QBs too.

I'm paying close attention to myself about this one right now. I am in your camp about Williams. I need to watch more film, but I'm on the avoid Williams path right now. And Im watching myself, because if this is the next Pat Mahomes, then I need to learn from how I got swayed away from him, and if he busts, I'm gonna believe even more in the "play within the design first, then create when it breaks if you have to" evaluation mode.

It's a real Ryan Leaf / Payton Manning moment in NFL draft history.

I truly wonder what we will all think about Caleb Williams in three years.

And who will Justin Fields be this time next year.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

3 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

yeah he really is the best running QB ever. And he will end up with those rushing numbers pretty soon.
 

You might be right, but of course there are other rookie QBs too.

I'm paying close attention to myself about this one right now. I am in your camp about Williams. I need to watch more film, but I'm on the avoid Williams path right now. And Im watching myself, because if this is the next Pat Mahomes, then I need to learn from how I got swayed away from him, and if he busts, I'm gonna believe even more in the "play within the design first, then create when it breaks if you have to" evaluation mode.

It's a real Ryan Leaf / Payton Manning moment in NFL draft history.

I truly wonder what we will all think about Caleb Williams in three years.

And who will Justin Fields be this time next year.

I am leaning Jayden Daniel's over the others.  After the ND game, Caleb dropped in my books, and he was contained the next few games against Utah and Washington.

[Stinger226]

7 hours ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

I am leaning Jayden Daniel's over the others.  After the ND game, Caleb dropped in my books, and he was contained the next few games against Utah and Washington.

Poles will evaluate these prospects completely and make the best decision going forward. Yes in 3 yrs you would have to pay Fields if you keep him but he has not laddered this team with big contracts. Sweat, Edmunds and DJ. (figuring Whitehair and EJAC gone), only Sweat carries a contract that will have a big dead money fix. 8 mil. Edmunds 4 mil and DJ 0. With cap money continuing going up , it wont be a problem if we pay him. If we draft Williams, his money will be 16 mil his first 2 years. Fields will earn 31 mil. The gap is not outrageous, money will not be a problem. 

If he thinks there is a generational QB, he will draft him . The key word is IF. 

Mooney has not had a good year, but he could be brought back on a cheap contract. We will probably find out he had a nagging injury but I think with all the attention DJ and Kmet gets its more of a confidence problem. As far as the draft, remember the names Malichi Corley and Xavier Legette .

[ASHKUM BEAR]

44 minutes ago, Stinger226 said:

Poles will evaluate these prospects completely and make the best decision going forward. Yes in 3 yrs you would have to pay Fields if you keep him but he has not laddered this team with big contracts. Sweat, Edmunds and DJ. (figuring Whitehair and EJAC gone), only Sweat carries a contract that will have a big dead money fix. 8 mil. Edmunds 4 mil and DJ 0. With cap money continuing going up , it wont be a problem if we pay him. If we draft Williams, his money will be 16 mil his first 2 years. Fields will earn 31 mil. The gap is not outrageous, money will not be a problem. 

If he thinks there is a generational QB, he will draft him . The key word is IF. 

Mooney has not had a good year, but he could be brought back on a cheap contract. We will probably find out he had a nagging injury but I think with all the attention DJ and Kmet gets its more of a confidence problem. As far as the draft, remember the names Malichi Corley and Xavier Legette .

Legette is now hovering round 1 and Corley round 2.  I wouldn't be upset with a Daniels and WR Nabor.

[Connorbear]

i want the Bears to trade out of the #1 pick and get the best return they can. I would be OK with draft a QB on day 2 to develop behind Justin. I don't see resetting the QB clock as having any benefit for us as I think we are ready to compete for the playoff next year. 

Peace

 

[Stinger226]

9 minutes ago, Connorbear said:

i want the Bears to trade out of the #1 pick and get the best return they can. I would be OK with draft a QB on day 2 to develop behind Justin. I don't see resetting the QB clock as having any benefit for us as I think we are ready to compete for the playoff next year. 

Peace

 

Agree with all of that. If Fields  thrives, he is still on the team . You develop a prospect for 2 yrs. All bases covered.

[killakrzydav]

I'd punt on Qbs in the top ten unless its Daniels. Penix or Nix in the late second is ok I guess. Beck next year would be a good get. I've come around to Justin may be our guy and I don't think either of the top two QB prospects are better than JF currently.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

3 hours ago, killakrzydav said:

I'd punt on Qbs in the top ten unless its Daniels. Penix or Nix in the late second is ok I guess. Beck next year would be a good get. I've come around to Justin may be our guy and I don't think either of the top two QB prospects are better than JF currently.

I would love in the mid-1st Jaylen Daniels or 2nd rd Ewers. Depends on what the Bears want.  Daniel's is going to be more of a mobile QB, I'd say similiar to JF.  Ewers is a pocket QB.  With Getsy being a GB system guy, I'd say a pure pocket QB is his direction.

I wish the Bears had a OC that designed the system to fit the player more like Bal with Jackson or Harbaugh w Kapernick. 

[Stinger226]

I think there's at least 3 going top 10. Probably a few more in first round.

[Stinger226]

Here is a nice article for people to use for arguing either way with the QB of the future.

https://www.windycitygridiron.com/2023/12/15/24002218/chicago-bears-justin-fields-trade-pros-cons-caleb-williams-drake-maye-2024-nfl-offseason

[Pixote]

6 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

Here is a nice article for people to use for arguing either way with the QB of the future.

https://www.windycitygridiron.com/2023/12/15/24002218/chicago-bears-justin-fields-trade-pros-cons-caleb-williams-drake-maye-2024-nfl-offseason

Thanks, That was an outstanding article.

I personally think that unless Fields' play in the last 4 games makes it clear which option for our future is best, that it will be a decision Poles will make once he gets offers for the #1 pick, as well as offers for a Fields' trade. He will carefully compare the options he has. At that point, I think he will pull the trigger on a move to give the Bears' the best chance to improve and become a force in the NFL instead of a running joke.

[adam]

What's wild is the Bears can keep on trading back one of their firsts for more firsts. Technically, they could do it indefinitely as long as there is a trading partner.

[BearFan PHX]

1 hour ago, Pixote said:

Thanks, That was an outstanding article.

I personally think that unless Fields' play in the last 4 games makes it clear which option for our future is best, that it will be a decision Poles will make once he gets offers for the #1 pick, as well as offers for a Fields' trade. He will carefully compare the options he has. At that point, I think he will pull the trigger on a move to give the Bears' the best chance to improve and become a force in the NFL instead of a running joke.

I agree with all of this, but i think it overlooks the most major part of his decision.

We generally tend to think in terms of Fields performance, and trade value, and how good the rookies would be, but looming over all of this in the decision is the salary cap.

If you keep JF this year, you're gonna pick up his 5th year option in May, and then you cant cut him, so theres no "wait and see how he does" at that point youre committed for 2 years and $30 Million on the salary cap. Signing him to a long term deal will prevent signing the rookie class that has Gordon and Brisker to long term deals.

I suppose you could pay him $30 Mil for two years and then cut him, but there is no guarantee that we'd have a top pick to get the QB then.

If youre the kind of person who thinks that a decent QB is good enough if you build around him, then with the salary cap implications you pretty much have to move on from Fields.

If on the other hand, youre SURe that Fields is a top 5 QB, then you pay him, and whatever it takes. But you see what that's done to Mahomes in KC, and what it did to Rodgers in GB. Theres no $ left for a defense or someone to catch your passes.

Brady routinely took $10 Million less a year than his worth in order to keep players around him. But hes the only one that did that as far as I know.

So the wait and see on Fields is over. We are at a salary cap moment where we have to be sure now, and i cant see how anyone could be sure right now.

So that, more than any other reason is why Fields is likely gone.